Hillary Clinton just gave people another reason to vote for Trump

Chew Toy McCoy

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I think you’re a fool if you think the days of the spite vote are completely behind us. Recently Hillary Clinton was quoted as saying if Trump won a second term she would be sick to her stomach. What a great gift to QAnon believers. Her 2016 campaign insiders took note that her numbers would drop the more she opened her yapper and that is the main reason she didn’t campaign where she should have. It appears she’s not done throwing her brand of wrench in Democrat’s spokes.
 

SuperMatt

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It’s nuts to see right-wingers wetting themselves over the Hunter Biden laptop... even though none of the info on it has been verified, and in fact is considered to be part of a Russian propaganda and disinformation campaign. Then they’re like “Why isn’t the MSM covering this?” - um, because they cover actual news?
 

Eric

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It’s nuts to see right-wingers wetting themselves over the Hunter Biden laptop... even though none of the info on it has been verified, and in fact is considered to be part of a Russian propaganda and disinformation campaign. Then they’re like “Why isn’t the MSM covering this?” - um, because they cover actual news?
Yeah, it's making the Trump nutbags crazy and it's actually sort of entertaining to watch. But the rest of the country is like WTF? There is no way this is reaching out to swing voters.
 

Chew Toy McCoy

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Yeah, it's making the Trump nutbags crazy and it's actually sort of entertaining to watch. But the rest of the country is like WTF? There is no way this is reaching out to swing voters.
I'm convinced the man doesn't own a mirror, literally or ethically. If he did he wouldn't look the way he does or be telling people to focus on nepotism based corruption. The level of his family's involvement in his administration and outside business is like a Voltron made out of pots and kettles.
 

SuperMatt

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Yeah, it's making the Trump nutbags crazy and it's actually sort of entertaining to watch. But the rest of the country is like WTF? There is no way this is reaching out to swing voters.
I seriously don't get Fox News at all. There are actual things happening in the world, but the only things happening according to Fox website today: 50 stories about how Hunter Biden was part of a plot to drop a nuke on Nebraska, or to murder the Pope, or something - whatever it is, it must be earth-shattering, some people broke into a WalMart in Philadelphia, and Ricky Martin, former member of Menudo, doesn't like Trump... which is news? No wonder the people that watch this garbage have literally no idea what is happening on planet earth.
 

Eric

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I seriously don't get Fox News at all. There are actual things happening in the world, but the only things happening according to Fox website today: 50 stories about how Hunter Biden was part of a plot to drop a nuke on Nebraska, or to murder the Pope, or something - whatever it is, it must be earth-shattering, some people broke into a WalMart in Philadelphia, and Ricky Martin, former member of Menudo, doesn't like Trump... which is news? No wonder the people that watch this garbage have literally no idea what is happening on planet earth.
I watched Chris Wallace on Sunday and it was actually pretty grounded and echoed what was really going on but I think it's their looney pundit shows that spread all of that shit.
 

Chew Toy McCoy

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I watched Chris Wallace on Sunday and it was actually pretty grounded and echoed what was really going on but I think it's their looney pundit shows that spread all of that shit.
Aside from the pox that was Russiagate, or at least the amount of time and energy dedicated to it, I feel like left leaning media presents facts and data even in opinion pieces while Fox’s equivalent is based on conspiracy theories, a world view that only exists when you don’t leave your golden tower, and mental gymnastics whataboutisms.
 

Scepticalscribe

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I think you’re a fool if you think the days of the spite vote are completely behind us. Recently Hillary Clinton was quoted as saying if Trump won a second term she would be sick to her stomach. What a great gift to QAnon believers. Her 2016 campaign insiders took note that her numbers would drop the more she opened her yapper and that is the main reason she didn’t campaign where she should have. It appears she’s not done throwing her brand of wrench in Democrat’s spokes.

It is no longer 2016, and those who cited their dislike of Secretary Clinton (this ludicrous requirement
that women candidates for public office must appear to be 'likeable' is a standard that does not seem to extend to loathsome louts, and repellant bullies, such as Mr Trump) as a reason not to vote Democrat - which was just an excuse as many of them were misogynists anyway, and would not have voted for Mother Theresa had she appeared on the ticket, - are hardly likely to vote Democrat now.

And, besides, firstly, Secretary Clinton is not the Democrat candidate on this occasion, Mr Biden is.

And secondly, she was absolutely right in 2016: Those who supported, voted for, enabled, facilitated, tolerated, Mr Trump were deplorable, - they were utterly deportee - and they still are. And which of us would not be utterly sick to our stomachs if that foul person, that corrosively corrupt creature, that moral monster, were to be returned to office?

Given all the vile venom that Mr Trump has given voice to - words which have been cheered witlessly by his craven supporters - it strikes me as a ludicrous (and possibly sexist), double standard to ask Secretary Clinton to remain silent (the same request has not been made of Mr Obama who made a splendidly scathing speech criticising Mr Trump yesterday, to the barely restrained fury of the latter) - when what she has said makes complete sense.

I doubt she’ll change any more minds than Hunter Biden’s laptop did.

Agreed.
 
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Chew Toy McCoy

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It is no longer 2016, and those who cited their dislike of Secretary Clinton (this ludicrous requirement
that women candidates for public office must appear to be 'likeable' is a standard that does not seem to extend to loathsome louts, and repellant bullies, such as Mr Trump) as a reason not to vote Democrat - which was just an excuse as many of them were misogynists anyway, and would not have voted for Mother Theresa had she appeared on the ticket, - are hardly likely to vote Democrat now.

And, besides, firstly, Secretary Clinton is not the Democrat candidate on this occasion, Mr Biden is. And secondly, she was right in 2016 - those who supported, voted for, enabled, facilitated, tolerated, Mr Trump were deplorable, and they still are. And which of us would not be utterly sick to our stomachs if that foul person, that corrosively corrupt creature, that moral monster, were to be returned to office?

Given all the vile venom that Mr Trump has given voice to - words which have been cheered witlessly by his craven supporters - it strikes me as a ludicrous (and possibly sexist), double standard to ask Secretary Clinton to remain silent (the same request has not been made of Mr Obama who made a splendidly scathing speech criticising Mr Trump yesterday, to the barely restrained fury of the latter) - when what she has said makes sense.



Agreed.
I know plenty on the left who don’t like Clinton and it has nothing to do with gender. I hope your belief in that doesn’t blind you to her many flaws, among which are being smug in both herself and in the belief that everybody was doing great under Obama and her being the definitive poster woman for meritocracy. “I have all this on my resume. So you all owe me the presidency.” There’s a major difference between Obama opening his mouth and Clinton opening hers, and the 2 shouldn’t be equated. She’s the Dick Cheney of the Democrats, with a slight edge to Cheney because he seems to be somewhat aware of being disliked and shouldn’t be chiming in. I don’t think there’s a soul alive who isn’t aware that nothing good is going to come from Clinton weighing in, even if you agree with what she says. It’s more about who is saying it.
 

Scepticalscribe

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I know plenty on the left who don’t like Clinton and it has nothing to do with gender. I hope your belief in that doesn’t blind you to her many flaws, among which are being smug in both herself and in the belief that everybody was doing great under Obama and her being the definitive poster woman for meritocracy. “I have all this on my resume. So you all owe me the presidency.” There’s a major difference between Obama opening his mouth and Clinton opening hers, and the 2 shouldn’t be equated. She’s the Dick Cheney of the Democrats, with a slight edge to Cheney because he seems to be somewhat aware of being disliked and shouldn’t be chiming in. I don’t think there’s a soul alive who isn’t aware that nothing good is going to come from Clinton weighing in, even if you agree with what she says. It’s more about who is saying it.

Plenty on the left disliked Secretary Clinton, agreed, and it had little to do with her gender.

However, - and I'm on the left, and have been ever since my teens, I do know these people - I would argue that plenty on the left - and I'm thinking of some of the "Bernie Bros" in the context of the US - are quite as militantly misogynistic (but are more subtle about it) as those who can be found far further right on the political spectrum.

I'm not blind to her flaws (and nor am I blind to those of her husband, who was yet one of the most compelling and charismatic individuals I have ever met), but I think that she is judged far more harshly for those flaws than a male with comparable flaws would have been.

Moreover, notwithstanding her flaws, she would have made a far better president (it would have been difficult to have been worse) than Mr Trump, and I believe that the electorate made an error of historic proportions in 2016 in failing to choose her, one of the most qualified and experienced individuals ever to seek the office of president.
 

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I would argue that plenty on the left - and I'm thinking of some of the "Bernie Bros" in the context of the US - are quite as militantly misogynistic (but are more subtle about it) as those who can be found far further right on the political spectrum.
Can you clarify? I mean, after being raised (not-Southern) Baptist, some shit happened in our family that landed my mother about Left of Gloria Steinem, so I tend to see things from a perspective she has inculcated me with. What I see from the misogynists on the alt-Right amounts to shitting on women, putting them in their place, making them dependent on men.

What is Leftist misogyny? I understand that there is a biological gulf between the sexes, and men struggle to understand women (or, more often, just give up trying), so some level of sexual division will probably always exist. But how do Left-ish policy goals compare? I get the impression that those on the left genuinely do want a more woman-friendly society and the existent misogyny is more an individual sort of thing.
 

Chew Toy McCoy

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Plenty on the left disliked Secretary Clinton, agreed, and it had little to do with her gender.

However, - and I'm on the left, and have been ever since my teens, I do know these people - I would argue that plenty on the left - and I'm thinking of some of the "Bernie Bros" in the context of the US - are quite as militantly misogynistic (but are more subtle about it) as those who can be found far further right on the political spectrum.

I'm not blind to her flaws (and nor am I blind to those of her husband, who was yet one of the most compelling and charismatic individuals I have ever met), but I think that she is judged far more harshly for those flaws than a male with comparable flaws would have been.

Moreover, notwithstanding her flaws, she would have made a far better president (it would have been difficult to have been worse) than Mr Trump, and I believe that the electorate made an error of historic proportions in 2016 in failing to choose her, one of the most qualified and experienced individuals ever to seek the office of president.
I think it’s extremely disingenuous to believe a big percentage of male Bernie supporters were/are sexists. We all know the biggest and loudest assholes in any group get the most media coverage completely slanting the reality. You might as well say that every Trump supporter is in a militia that wants to bring back slavery. Sanders and Clinton had way different platforms. Clinton represents the current establishment Democrats that even Regan would be left of if he ran today. Sanders platform is well covered and would put Hillary nowhere near a second best choice.

I think a Clinton win would have done more damage to the Progressive movement than Trump has. Clinton would have viewed her win as an approval of the Meritocracy started under Obama and catering to the interests of new money that started under her husband. I don’t see Biden going hardcore Progressive, but the party has been forced to acknowledge it’s not just a marginal blip in their traditional base and if anything positive comes from the pandemic is that both the health and economic impact can’t be answered by the status quo or short term band-aids. Some socialism is going to have to kick in unless they want a real revolution.
 

Thomas Veil

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I doubt she’ll change any more minds than Hunter Biden’s laptop did.
Yeah, the laptop. 🙄

I can’t tell you how pleased I am that for once an “October surprise” has landed with a resounding thud. Also that a large part of that is because the source was Rudy Giuliani and the overall reaction has been, oh, him again??

Makes me want to head over to The Old Country and ask Apple OC how the Durham investigation is coming along. 😏
 
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