Socializing health care doesn’t turn us into Stalin-era Soviets.

SuperMatt

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Marsha Blackburn warns Taylor Swift that music will be banned if we do anything “socialist.”


The war against any social programs by labeling them equivalent to Soviet policies is absurd. So far, such rhetoric seems to appeal to the Fox News addicts and first-generation immigrants from actual oppressive communist countries.
 
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Marsha Blackburn warns Taylor Swift that music will be banned if we do anything “socialist.”


The war against any social programs by labeling them equivalent to Soviet policies is absurd. So far, such rhetoric seems to appeal to the Fox News addicts and first-generation immigrants from actual oppressive communist countries.
This shit never gets old.:D The way these people describe socialism reminded me of a set of drawings of exotic animals by people who have never seen them just heard about them. She's confabulating in circles and it's actually pretty funny.

found it:

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Herdfan

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I worry less about the "socialism" aspect of it than the implementation aspect of it.

There is not one single thing our government does that is not rife with fraud, overspending and general mismanagement.

If anyone has an elderly parent, take a close look at the spending reports Medicare sends. It will blow your mind.

My mom is in her last days and the medical group where she is a patient has been sending a nurse over a couple of times a week to check on her. I was there one day when the nurse asked if she had a scale and my mom said yes, she did. (now I have no idea why it is so important a 92 year old woman can weigh herself). A few days later a nice electronic scale showed up. That you, me and everyone else who pays into FICA paid for. That is pure waste as she didn't need it and couldn't use it if she did. Saw it with my dad as well with a wheel chair they charged him monthly rental for when he was living in a nursing home. WTF.

Now expand that to everyone, not just the 65+ set and these companies will find ways to get as much of it as possible.

And then there is the fear of rationed care, but that is probably a non-starter here.
 
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I worry less about the "socialism" aspect of it than the implementation aspect of it.

There is not one single thing our government does that is not rife with fraud, overspending and general mismanagement.

If anyone has an elderly parent, take a close look at the spending reports Medicare sends. It will blow your mind.

My mom is in her last days and the medical group where she is a patient has been sending a nurse over a couple of times a week to check on her. I was there one day when the nurse asked if she had a scale and my mom said yes, she did. (now I have no idea why it is so important a 92 year old woman can weigh herself). A few days later a nice electronic scale showed up. That you, me and everyone else who pays into FICA paid for. That is pure waste as she didn't need it and couldn't use it if she did. Saw it with my dad as well with a wheel chair they charged him monthly rental for when he was living in a nursing home. WTF.

Now expand that to everyone, not just the 65+ set and these companies will find ways to get as much of it as possible.

And then there is the fear of rationed care, but that is probably a non-starter here.
The scale thing is weird...but I suspect they needed to report it for billing...because without vitals reported you might get a reimbursement hit.

I'll tell you that it's cheaper to prevent the most common cause of kidney failure by providing good and early care for hypertension than paying for dialysis which we do as it's an automatic medicare qualifier. So we'd save money overall and close our shameful outcome gaps compared to any other G8 nation. But I agree, the next step is to cut the administrative burden which is many times higher than any of the other G8 nations'.
 
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SuperMatt

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I worry less about the "socialism" aspect of it than the implementation aspect of it.

There is not one single thing our government does that is not rife with fraud, overspending and general mismanagement.

If anyone has an elderly parent, take a close look at the spending reports Medicare sends. It will blow your mind.

My mom is in her last days and the medical group where she is a patient has been sending a nurse over a couple of times a week to check on her. I was there one day when the nurse asked if she had a scale and my mom said yes, she did. (now I have no idea why it is so important a 92 year old woman can weigh herself). A few days later a nice electronic scale showed up. That you, me and everyone else who pays into FICA paid for. That is pure waste as she didn't need it and couldn't use it if she did. Saw it with my dad as well with a wheel chair they charged him monthly rental for when he was living in a nursing home. WTF.

Now expand that to everyone, not just the 65+ set and these companies will find ways to get as much of it as possible.

And then there is the fear of rationed care, but that is probably a non-starter here.
As a counter-argument: the private insurance industry is far worse for the people paying for the insurance. There’s a reason even Republicans supported the patient protections in Obamacare even while they opposed the individual mandate. Insurance companies were taking your money, and then when you got sick, they found every way possible to avoid paying for the care you thought you were paying for.

As for the fear of rationed care: America gives (mostly) free care to all senior citizens and has for a long time. How often do they run into the issue of rationed care currently?
 

JayMysteri0

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Revisiting the source of this stupidity, it's important to note who's bringing up who...

When's the last time Swift brought up Blackburn?

Blackburn's fake ass concern is so desperately about trying to grasp for attention on the name of someone who couldn't give a frog fart about her. But hey, scream "socialism", and the usual crowd comes a runnin'.
 
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Revisiting the source of this stupidity, it's important to note who's bringing up who...

When's the last time Swift brought up Blackburn?

Blackburn's fake ass concern is so desperately about trying to grasp for attention on the name of someone who couldn't give a frog fart about her. But hey, scream "socialism", and the usual crowd comes a runnin'.
What gave me the biggest chuckles really is how she projected her own prudery to Swift (about what she couldn't wear), whereas the socialism I got to experience was still much much much less prudish than Blackburn or the average American, LOL.
 
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Republicans love handouts**!


**(for corporations)
To be fair, that’s a pretty common issue accross the divide. It’s just more obvious and blatent with the GOP, but there’s plenty of Democrats who like to line the pockets or ease rules for thier friends.

Lobbying is the scourge of America. It’s long past when the country was run for the people, now its for the corporations. We’re just incidental.
 

Herdfan

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As a counter-argument: the private insurance industry is far worse for the people paying for the insurance. There’s a reason even Republicans supported the patient protections in Obamacare even while they opposed the individual mandate. Insurance companies were taking your money, and then when you got sick, they found every way possible to avoid paying for the care you thought you were paying for.

As for the fear of rationed care: America gives (mostly) free care to all senior citizens and has for a long time. How often do they run into the issue of rationed care currently?

I can give you an example. Three years ago my mom fell and broke her Tibia just below the knee. She was taken to the hospital where she stayed for 6 days. As an "Observation Only" patient. Her attending kept trying to change it to make her an Admitted patient, but Medicare kept rejecting it. This was an 89 year old female who couldn't walk, but Medicare wouldn't let her be admitted because then they would be on the hook for paying $400/day for 2 months of rehab.

Fortunately the hospital social worker was able to use a loophole to get her into a skilled nursing unit which gave her the required 3 days and forced Medicare to pay for her rehab.

That is rationed care. Had my wife and the social worker not kept on it, she would have simply been released to her home unable to walk. Is that what you want?

Then there is the whole, how do we pay for it. Rural hospitals are closing because they can't survive on a combination of Medicare reimbursements and what private insurance they do get. How will larger ones remain open with just Medicare reimbursements?
 
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SuperMatt

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I can give you an example. Three years ago my mom fell and broke her Tibia just below the knee. She was taken to the hospital where she stayed for 6 days. As an "Observation Only" patient. Her attending kept trying to change it to make her an Admitted patient, but Medicare kept rejecting it. This was an 89 year old female who couldn't walk, but Medicare wouldn't let her be admitted because then they would be on the hook for paying $400/day for 2 months of rehab.

Fortunately the hospital social worker was able to use a loophole to get her into a skilled nursing unit which gave her the required 3 days and forced Medicare to pay for her rehab.

That is rationed care. Had my wife and the social worker not kept on it, she would have simply been released to her home unable to walk. Is that what you want?

Then there is the whole, how do we pay for it. Rural hospitals are closing because they can't survive on a combination of Medicare reimbursements and what private insurance they do get. How will larger ones remain open with just Medicare reimbursements?
There are so many gaps in our system, both with Medicare and private insurance. One could come up with just as many stories where people who pay for insurance cannot get care either. One issue recently brought to light by the news: you go to an in-network hospital, but it just so happens that the regular anesthesiologist is on vacation, so they bring in a sub. You have no way of knowing this. After your “covered” surgery, you get a huge bill for anesthesiology that you thought was covered.

Considering the fact that healthcare currently comes with one’s job, I think Medicare is pretty much a necessity. How can a retired person afford to buy insurance?
 
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I can give you an example. Three years ago my mom fell and broke her Tibia just below the knee. She was taken to the hospital where she stayed for 6 days. As an "Observation Only" patient. Her attending kept trying to change it to make her an Admitted patient, but Medicare kept rejecting it. This was an 89 year old female who couldn't walk, but Medicare wouldn't let her be admitted because then they would be on the hook for paying $400/day for 2 months of rehab.

Fortunately the hospital social worker was able to use a loophole to get her into a skilled nursing unit which gave her the required 3 days and forced Medicare to pay for her rehab.

That is rationed care. Had my wife and the social worker not kept on it, she would have simply been released to her home unable to walk. Is that what you want?

Then there is the whole, how do we pay for it. Rural hospitals are closing because they can't survive on a combination of Medicare reimbursements and what private insurance they do get. How will larger ones remain open with just Medicare reimbursements?
Sorry but this story makes little sense to me. Though the stuff I cared for (generally acute stroke care) essentially always qualified as a full admission (2 midnights or more), even though in a reasonable world the workup could have been done under obs status.

When I was senior (and chief) resident I spent >70% of inpatient work hours figuring out disposition for patients from admission to discharge to rehab. For uninsured stroke patients who need rehab we wasted about 1.5-2 days ($6-8K) on average on unnecessary delays, etc. It would be great to eliminate these..
 
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There are so many gaps in our system, both with Medicare and private insurance. One could come up with just as many stories where people who pay for insurance cannot get care either. One issue recently brought to light by the news: you go to an in-network hospital, but it just so happens that the regular anesthesiologist is on vacation, so they bring in a sub. You have no way of knowing this. After your “covered” surgery, you get a huge bill for anesthesiology that you thought was covered.

Considering the fact that healthcare currently comes with one’s job, I think Medicare is pretty much a necessity. How can a retired person afford to buy insurance?
Emplyment dependent healthcare is just a terrible idea TBH.

There are "insurances" that are actually more like paid healthcare coupons..

Results: U.S. insurers and providers spent $812 billion on administration, amounting to $2497 per capita (34.2% of national health expenditures) versus $551 per capita (17.0%) in Canada: $844 versus $146 on insurers' overhead; $933 versus $196 for hospital administration; $255 versus $123 for nursing home, home care, and hospice administration; and $465 versus $87 for physicians' insurance-related costs.

Guess who are the best paid people in healthcare (hint: not physicians)
 
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SuperMatt

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Emplyment dependent healthcare is just a terrible idea TBH.

There are "insurances" that are actually more like paid healthcare coupons..



Guess who are the best paid people in healthcare (hint: not physicians)
Sounds like going to socialized medicine would be a rapid redistribution of wealth from overpaid insurance executives to public sector workers… and cheaper healthcare for everybody. I can see why anybody making above $200K a year in health insurance would hate this. Government officials cannot earn that kind of money.

I have family members in Canada and their taxes are higher than here, but none of them have to pay health insurance… and the system is pretty good. It’s a better deal IMHO. I wish we would switch to it.
 
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Sounds like going to socialized medicine would be a rapid redistribution of wealth from overpaid insurance executives to public sector workers… and cheaper healthcare for everybody. I can see why anybody making above $200K a year in health insurance would hate this. Government officials cannot earn that kind of money.

I have family members in Canada and their taxes are higher than here, but none of them have to pay health insurance… and the system is pretty good. It’s a better deal IMHO. I wish we would switch to it.
It's a complex issue. I've posted on this on reddit before. US healthcare is one of the most innovative systems, and subspecialty care (like what I do) is really consistently top in the world. But primary and secondary care stuff is mediocre at best and since those issue, like hypertension are more common, they also have a higher impact on outcomes and thus a better investment to take good care of. The trick is how to keep the innovation but improve basic care... I'd prefer a hybrid system, but shit like prior authorization bullshit pushed on providers need to stop (I can complain about that all day long).
 
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This.

It automatically excludes anyone working part-time, anyone between jobs, anyone unemployed….and on and on.
The more I learn about the US's history with slavery and how aspects of it were "saved" in the South, but also shaped the worker's rights in the North secondary to the Great Migration, the more I think the way we handle the health insurance system may be a remnant of this very thing. The fact that changing jobs/quitting can literally jeopardize your and your family's health is crazy, and grants unfair extra power of employers over employees. Let's say a 29-year-old loses their job after 10 years of consistent contribution to social security and medical insurance, and they suffer a perforated appendix. On a scale, how is a 100K medical bill (because I bet they're gonna seek help much later) is fair or reasonable? That bill will never be paid so the net "gain" of the situation is that people will just stick to exploitative work environments longer.
 

Herdfan

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Sorry but this story makes little sense to me. Though the stuff I cared for (generally acute stroke care) essentially always qualified as a full admission (2 midnights or more), even though in a reasonable world the workup could have been done under obs status.

When I was senior (and chief) resident I spent >70% of inpatient work hours figuring out disposition for patients from admission to discharge to rehab. For uninsured stroke patients who need rehab we wasted about 1.5-2 days ($6-8K) on average on unnecessary delays, etc. It would be great to eliminate these..

The DR's and social worker couldn't figure it out either. Dr. kept admitting her, Medicare would kick it back out. Perhaps it was because it was just a fracture and not a complete break. No idea.
 
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