COVID Stupid

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Peter Principal
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I don't really trust those numbers. After all, if you have 50% of a company vaccinated and then fire 100% of the unvaccinated, you can then claim 100%. But it won't be because the rest of the people complied.

It is a tactic businesses use to make their books look better called Denominator Management.




I had another thought about this post. You typed around 50 words when a Google search using 4 words (Mayo Clinic Vaccine Mandate) would have given you the answer. My link was the top hit, so you don't even have to go though multiple hits.

I guess you were hoping I didn't have a source or that I would link a Fox or OAN or NewsMax etc source so you could spend time talking about that instead of something that goes against what you want to believe. Sorry to have messed that up for you.
Funny you brought up fox news the third time, I haven’t mentioned it at all. It’s just basic decency not to expect others to do your job by providing support to your statements. You high fiving yourself for meeting the bare minimum of communication is hilarious on its own.

So now that you have your sources up, what do you think about that ~98% vaccination rate from a few months ago? Is it something worth arguing about? How come the most educated people in healthcare are >96% compliant even without a mandate?

About staffing shortage, your article doesn’t get into it, but so you know, that emerged more than a year ago and has very very little to do with vaccine mandates and more so with people having more leverage when it comes to lower paying, lower skilled jobs.

This whole mandate shitshow is a protracted temper tantrum about being forced. In the meantime, hospital systems at the caliber of Mayo had mandatory Influenza vaccination requirements for a decade. Yet you never whined about that. Why is that? Because it’s not about vaccines or mandates for you.
 
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hulugu

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....Nope, it’s just THIS vaccine, because the total fucking moron Donald Trump started blathering about “Freedom” when it comes to THIS vaccine... and he only did so once he lost the election. Before that, he had no problem with the vaccine, and his minions would have been first in line if he mandated it. You don’t even know what freedom is. There are millions more like you, and America is falling into the shitter because of it.

Worth noting" Fox News requires vaccinations, and nearly everyone in the network, including those jabbering on about "freedom" got vaccinated. So did nearly everyone in the Trump inner-circle.

The people espousing this idea that "freedom" trumps public health are all well-protected by the vaccine and their wealth and privilege, and are working against the vaccine because they believe that it will hurt Biden.

Anyone talking about the idea that freedom is damaged by vaccinations is either part of the plot against America, or a fucking dolt.
 

SuperMatt

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COVID has killed 4x more police officers than gunfire has.

More than 460 American law enforcement officers have died from Covid-19 infections tied to their work since the start of the pandemic, according to the Officer Down Memorial Page, making the coronavirus by far the most common cause of duty-related deaths in 2020 and 2021. More than four times as many officers have died from Covid-19 as from gunfire in that period. There is no comprehensive accounting of how many American police officers have been sickened by the virus, but departments across the country have reported large outbreaks in the ranks.

125 of those deaths have come since August 2021. So all 125 of those were certainly preventable if the officers had been vaccinated.

Yet as more departments in recent weeks have considered requiring members to be vaccinated, officers and their unions have loudly pushed back, in some cases threatening resignations or flooding systems with requests for exemptions.

I don’t think municipalities should allow the police to push them back on the mandates. After all, if they don’t get the shots, they’ll probably die anyway, and you’re still gonna be short on police officers.

(Paywall removed)
 

hulugu

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I don't really trust those numbers. After all, if you have 50% of a company vaccinated and then fire 100% of the unvaccinated, you can then claim 100%. But it won't be because the rest of the people complied.

It is a tactic businesses use to make their books look better called Denominator Management.




I had another thought about this post. You typed around 50 words when a Google search using 4 words (Mayo Clinic Vaccine Mandate) would have given you the answer. My link was the top hit, so you don't even have to go though multiple hits.

I guess you were hoping I didn't have a source or that I would link a Fox or OAN or NewsMax etc source so you could spend time talking about that instead of something that goes against what you want to believe. Sorry to have messed that up for you.

Next time you could just post the source and stop making people jump through hoops. And, yeah, people jump on Fox and the rest because they're part of a ridiculous propaganda network, and no one wants to click through their bullshit to get to the actual story.
 

Herdfan

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Next time you could just post the source and stop making people jump through hoops. And, yeah, people jump on Fox and the rest because they're part of a ridiculous propaganda network, and no one wants to click through their bullshit to get to the actual story.

I just figured since he knows everything, he already knew what their policy was.
 

hulugu

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Personally, I resent West getting the Regeneron treatment. That should be reserved for people who are not anti-vaxxers.

I have no problem with people getting the treatment they need based on medical science, but West's case just proves how fucking dumb he is.

(I'm swearing a lot today, but it's because I'm irritated and trying to emphasize my points.)

So, West ducked the $20 shot that his wife got, blathering on about freedom. Then, he got COVID-19. Now, his wife was vaccinated, but because of his stupidity, they both got the Regeneron treatment. Now, Regeneron is not FDA approved yet—still being used under the EUA—and it was developed using a decades-old fetal line.
 

SuperMatt

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Why didn’t Ozzy Osbourne get COVID-19... Could it be...

1902527176-church_lady_could_it_be_satan.jpeg


 

Edd

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Re: Fox. This clip I watched today has a different overall topic than COVID, but has a supercut of Fox twits hilariously offended by government mandating vaccines for any reason, like it’s all brand new.

 

Alli

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I do believe in vaccines. I wish more people were vaccinated. Where I draw the line is the government mandating them. Businesses can do what they want.
The government (federal or state) should also not prevent businesses from mandating them. (Looking at you, Governor Abbott.)
 

hulugu

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The government (federal or state) should also not prevent businesses from mandating them. (Looking at you, Governor Abbott.)

Yeah, we're in this goofy tug-of-war between the Biden administration and Texas' government over vaccine mandates. And, the increasingly strident fools in the GQP are pushing against not only the COVID-19 vaccine, but against any kind of vaccine mandate, presaging a sudden growth in childhood diseases that are normally kept at bay.

While it's clear that the federal government has the right to require vaccines under OSHA, Texas could challenge that specific order. But, rather than consider that challenge, instead, the governor has decided to undermine every vaccination program in the state.

And, the state can't possibly win on this. They're fighting a legal battle on three sides—challenging the federal government's supremacy clause, undermining the rights of private businesses, and undermining the rights of local governments like school districts, cities, and counties.
 

SuperMatt

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Yeah, we're in this goofy tug-of-war between the Biden administration and Texas' government over vaccine mandates. And, the increasingly strident fools in the GQP are pushing against not only the COVID-19 vaccine, but against any kind of vaccine mandate, presaging a sudden growth in childhood diseases that are normally kept at bay.

While it's clear that the federal government has the right to require vaccines under OSHA, Texas could challenge that specific order. But, rather than consider that challenge, instead, the governor has decided to undermine every vaccination program in the state.

And, the state can't possibly win on this. They're fighting a legal battle on three sides—challenging the federal government's supremacy clause, undermining the rights of private businesses, and undermining the rights of local governments like school districts, cities, and counties.
I’m sure they can get the Supreme Court to allow the law to stand as an “emergency order” until the law can be challenged… if the most recent precedent is any indicator.

I am concerned about how ideological the Supreme Court has become. We’ve had a conservative court for a while, but the blatant disregard for precedent in favor of far-right ideology while going on public relations tours to justify the behavior worries me.
 

SuperMatt

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Many on this board cheer when people get fired for not getting vaccinated. And that's fine, you have the freedom and right.

But what happens when so many healthcare workers get fired and YOU need critical care and there are no ICU beds, not because they are filled with COVID patients, but because there are not enough workers to staff them?
Steve Doocy asked the same question... So let’s have Jen Psaki answer:


Of course, I’m getting now where you probably got the question from. 🦜
 

P_X

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I just figured since he knows everything, he already knew what their policy was.
I'll let you in on a secret: I use search engines quickly and efficiently and I make a substantial effort (at least on your scale) to understand opposing viewpoints. I start calling people out when I repeatedly catch them on not reading their own sources. Which has been my impression about you. I suspect you only read headlines and even cherry pick those.

The other thing I call people out for is intellectual cowardice. When your statements meet opposition, you make a 30sec effort to push back and if defending your stance takes more than that, you just wait out the topic change. Like here, I've asked you a bunch of questions and you've just tried to change the topic.

1. If you are such an advocate of medical freedom and oppose vaccine mandates, how come this didn't come to your mind when it came to Influenza?

Mayo's researchers' stand:

Most hospitals I worked at has had an Influenza vaccine mandate for a looong time:

But academic programs mandate this and suspend clinical access of students if they aren't up to date:
MGH for example:

That above is a pretty standard list, and my antibody titers were assessed and I got repeat shots for diseases where my titers were low.
Again standard procedure. Where were you to defend my medical freedom then?

2. Are you willing to admit that staffing issues predate COVID vaccine mandates?
3. Are you willing to admit that running ICUs at capacity had contributed manyfold more to the staffing shortage than mandates?


An example from a local WV Hospital system:
It is particularly concerning as facilities from other states call West Virginia hospitals seeking beds for their own patients.
“Should we get to a capacity point, which we are close to, we will probably not have the ability to transfer patients to other states, or we’ll have challenges transferring patients to other states,” Hoyer said.

Health-care staffing shortages pre-date COVID-19, but the pandemic has exacerbated the problem.

At a time when the patient census is at or nearing capacity, staff members are unable to work because of COVID-19 infection or COVID-19 exposure requiring quarantine. This is being seen in hospitals across the state.

4. If you admit that staffing issues are most significantly impacted by the pandemic itself, wouldn't measures that control the pandemic be the most effective way to fight staffing issues?

5. You still have to answer: if COVID-19 is an indirect act of bioterrorism, isn't it the patriotic thing to do is to get vaccinated?


To provide my stance on all of this as a father of small children. The ultimate parenting success is to get your kids do the right thing without intimidation, but sometimes you have to be assertive to prevent them from hurting themselves. I believe in the same principle societally. America did a truly impressive job making smoking uncool and frowned upon. Opposing vaccination should receive similar societal attitudes. Yet here you are claiming to be a "vaccine-believer" but also normalizing antivaxxer sentiments.
 
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