Mr Trump Refuses To Commit To A Peaceful Transfer Of Power If Defeated

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Asked during a White House press conference if he would commit to a peaceful transfer of power in the light of the recent unrest in various cities, Mr Trump replied: “Well, we’re going to have to see what happens.”

In an apparent reference to postal voting, which is expected to be used widely by voters (mostly voters who may vote Democrat, an issue where the decision to take health precautions and political preference strongly intersect) in the election due to coronavirus, Mr Trump said during a news conference: “I’ve been complaining very strongly about the ballots… Get rid of the ballots, and you’ll have a very peaceful,” he said, trailing off. “There won’t be a transfer, there’ll be a continuation. The ballots are out of control.”

To say I'm flabbergasted and horrified is an understatement, and to hear such words from the mouth of an American president is shocking, shaming and appalling.
 

Edd70

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I don’t see this as anything new for Trump. Has he ever said he’d step aside if voted out? He’s danced around it his entire presidency. To suggest that he’d leave the WH would make him a loser, and he’s no loser.

This‘ll dominate the cycle today, and seems a waste of time.
 

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I don’t see this as anything new for Trump. Has he ever said he’d step aside if voted out? He’s danced around it his entire presidency. To suggest that he’d leave the WH would make him a loser, and he’s no loser.

This‘ll dominate the cycle today, and seems a waste of time.

I beg to differ.

My fear is that he will stoke (and encourage) such division - and violence - inflame passions, generate discord - so much so that conditions (which he has inflamed further) will plausibly allow him to suspend civil liberties, invoke the Insurrection Act, and deploy the National Guard on a federal basis.
 

Edd70

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I beg to differ.

My fear is that he will stoke (and encourage) such division - and violence - inflame passions, generate discord - so much so that conditions (which he has inflamed further) will plausibly allow him to suspend civil liberties, invoke the Insurrection Act, and deploy the National Guard on a federal basis.
He’s not above doing any of that...if the bait is taken. I liken it to overreacting to a child’s misbehavior. If I react to every stupid thing he says, I’ll pass out from exhaustion.
 

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He’s not above doing any of that...if the bait is taken. I liken it to overreacting to a child’s misbehavior. If I react to every stupid thing he says, I’ll pass out from exhaustion.

But he is not a child, instead, he has power, enablers, facilitators, and the temperament - as you say - of a spoiled and indulged and entitled bully of a child who wrecks havoc when thwarted; the combination of those characteristics and features is toxic for the future well being of the US. And the world.
 

Edd70

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But he is not a child, instead, he has power, enablers, facilitators, and the temperament - as you say - of a spoiled and indulged and entitled bully of a child who wrecks havoc when thwarted; the combination of those characteristics and features is toxic for the future well being of the US. And the world.
I think we 99% agree. My point is simply that it was already pretty obvious he’ll do anything to stay in the Oval. There’s no news here.
 

Alli

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We knew he would do anything possible to remain in power. Not in office - in power. There is a difference with him because he does not care about the office. We have to remain calm and not allow the kind of hysteria that his behavior can lead to. It won’t do anyone any good. Keep calm, campaign, get out the vote. There is nothing we can do at this point in time.
 

PearsonX

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Him pulling any shit like this would even make people like me (who think mass gathering is a bad idea now) flood the streets.
At this point he is willingly destroying the country to stay out of jail. Just ask Netanyahu about how that works.
 
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Alli

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Him pulling any shit like this would even make people like me (who think mass gathering is a bad idea now) flood the streets.
At this point he is willingly destroy the country to stay out of jail. Just ask Netanyahu about how that works.

The worse part is that some of us have guns too. Do you think “they” think we don’t?
 

ericgtr12

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Him pulling any shit like this would even make people like me (who think mass gathering is a bad idea now) flood the streets.
At this point he is willingly destroy the country to stay out of jail. Just ask Netanyahu about how that works.
This is my take as well, he's basically saying he wants to strip people's right to vote and if he doesn't think they will rise up (and I don't just mean BLM) against this then he's nuts. What's sad about all of this is I could see Republicans going along, they've completely sold their souls to this devil, years ago I would say "they would lever let Trump get away with this or that" but in every single case they have.
 

PearsonX

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This is my take as well, he's basically saying he wants to strip people's right to vote and if he doesn't think they (and I don't just mean BLM) will rise up against this then he's nuts. What's sad about all of this is I could see Republicans going along, they've completely sold their souls to this devil, years ago I would say "they would lever let Trump get away with this or that" but in every single case they have.
Just listening to Rand Paul gives me an idea about republican quality control.
 

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I think we 99% agree.

Yes, we do.

I think we 99% agree. My point is simply that it was already pretty obvious he’ll do anything to stay in the Oval. There’s no news here.

This is where we disagree.

I think that this is extraordinary news, and the fact that those on the Right (in the Other Place) shrug it off absolutely stupefies me.

Elsewhere, we discussed Mr Lukashenko (who was inaugurated in a secret ceremony a few days ago), Belarus and rigged elections.

To me, it is unconscionable that a president in a western democracy should actually think this, and should think it is okay to say it.

Personally, I think it is huge news, - it is a fresh, new, appalling low - a stake through the heart of anyone who looked to the US as a model of democratic conduct and behaviour - it is a clear signal that there is nothing that this man does not consider appropriate or his right to try to do to hold onto office and power, that the rule of law, separation of powers, and traditions of his office mean absolutely nothing to him.

Have any of you any idea of what this sort of stuff - especially if those on his side or in his administration make no effort or show no interest in disavowal or distancing themselves - does to the reputation (already tarnished) of the US abroad?

That is the mindset - and behaviour - of an autocrat, one who dreams of dictatorship, of untrammelled, unaccountable and uncontrolled rule.

That those who support him have yet to distance themselves from this outrageous and scandalous threat - someone who was democratically elected suggesting that they are not answerable to the ballot box and calling the legitimacy of that ballot into doubt - this is monstrous, and it is also political catnip for those who would seek to undermine democratic principles, that distasteful assembly line of aspiring autocrats, a veritable roll call of inglorious names.
 
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PearsonX

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Yes, we do.



This is where we disagree.

I think that this is extraordinary news, and the fact that those on the Right (in the Other Place) shrug it off absolutely stupefies me.

Elsewhere, we discussed Mr Lukashenko (who was inaugurated in a secret ceremony a few days ago), Belarus and rigged elections.

To me, it is unconscionable that a president in a western democracy should actually think this, and should think it is okay to say it.

Personally, I think it is huge news, - it is a fresh, new, appalling low - a stake through the heart of anyone who looked to the US as a model of democratic conduct and behaviour - it is a clear signal that the is nothing that this man does not consider appropriate or his right to try to do to hold onto office and power, that the rule of law, separation of powers, and traditions of his office mean absolutely nothing to him.

Have any of you any idea of what this sort of stuff - especially if those on his side or in his administration make no effort or show no interest in disavowal or distancing themselves - does to the reputation (already tarnished) of the US abroad?

That is the mindset - and behaviour - of an autocrat, one who dreams of dictatorship, of untrammelled, unaccountable and uncontrolled rule.

That those who support him have yet to distance themselves from this outrageous and scandalous threat - someone who was democratically elected suggesting that they are not answerable to the ballot box and calling the legitimacy of that ballot into doubt - this is monstrous, and it is also political catnip for those who would seek to undermine democratic principles, that distasteful assembly line of aspiring autocrats, a veritable roll call of inglorious names.
Both of you are right here. No news in criminals criming. But the ballot offensive is also ridiculous. He's never coherent, but what does even "getting rid of the ballots" mean? No matter how you vote, ballots are used, so does he mean getting rid of voting?

Lukashenko's major miscalculation was "winning" 80% of the votes. Any "reasonable" dictator knows that you give a little more votes to your opponents, so 1) they get demoralized over time when they fail to make major gains and 2) have the façade of legitimacy. WHat's happening there BTW is what I've been expecting: a Russian takeover. Annexation is only a matter of time. Like the good ol' times of the Soviet Union. Did I already say ABSOLUTELY FUCK THE SOVIET UNION?
 

ericgtr12

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Both of you are right here. No news in criminals criming. But the ballot offensive is also ridiculous. He's never coherent, but what does even "getting rid of the ballots" mean? No matter how you vote, ballots are used, so does he mean getting rid of voting?

Lukashenko's major miscalculation was "winning" 80% of the votes. Any "reasonable" dictator knows that you give a little more votes to your opponents, so 1) they get demoralized over time when they fail to make major gains and 2) have the façade of legitimacy. WHat's happening there BTW is what I've been expecting: a Russian takeover. Annexation is only a matter of time. Like the good ol' times of the Soviet Union. Did I already say ABSOLUTELY FUCK THE SOVIET UNION?
I took it to mean just that, if he could do away with voting and/or delegitimize it to where there's no point he will have succeeded. This is the exact same model they use in Russia and we know Trump worships everything about them.
 

Chew Toy McCoy

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Maybe he'll need to be removed by a secret service sniper. That will be something Republicans can't do a 180 on when it works in their favor because he will be dead, but also probably a better President in that state.
 

PearsonX

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Maybe he'll need to be removed by a secret service sniper. That will be something Republicans can't do a 180 on when it works in their favor because he will be dead, but also probably a better President in that state.
That would actually work in favor of Republicans. Trump would become a martyr and they would not have to deal with his shenanigans anymore.

But seriously, let's hope that the election will be 10% of the expected shitshow and the transition will be as peaceful as it gets.
 

Chew Toy McCoy

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That would actually work in favor of Republicans. Trump would become a martyr and they would not have to deal with his shenanigans anymore.

But seriously, let's hope that the election will be 10% of the expected shitshow and the transition will be as peaceful as it gets.

Let’s face it, even if Trump gets irrefutably crushed in the election, it will still somehow be a win for his supporters as proof to them that the deep state exists. He’ll be a martyr to them regardless. That’s how they roll. Part of me wants Trump’s diehard supporters to be punished by being thrown even deeper into the marginalized and forgotten self-defined world’s biggest victim hole they emerged from to put him in office, but I think Trump has already done enough divisive code red damage and we should get to know and listen to each other again and partner over our shared concerns.
 

PearsonX

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Let’s face it, even if Trump gets irrefutably crushed in the election, it will still somehow be a win for his supporters as proof to them that the deep state exists. He’ll be a martyr to them regardless. That’s how they roll. Part of me wants Trump’s diehard supporters to be punished by being thrown even deeper into the marginalized and forgotten self-defined world’s biggest victim hole they emerged from to put him in office, but I think Trump has already done enough divisive code red damage and we should get to know and listen to each other again and partner over our shared concerns.
And that's what we'll do because we are actual adults.
 
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