The Republican Agenda 2021 and Forward

[Huntn]

When a minority party tries to take control, the results are almost always disastrous. If you make elections a mockery, or try a military coup, etc… the majority will find a way to make their voices heard.

Gerrymandering a 60% or more majority of seats in a legislature when you have less than 50% of the overall votes... you are going to have an uprising if you keep that up very long.

We’ll find out how many cherish their democracy or don’t at some point.

Problem is, they have all the guns.

It doesn’t have to be violent.

What if they make it violent? Trump wanted martial law and the military told him to fuck off. What happens next time? When lies prevail, when truth means nothing and a majority does not care or a significant % can break all the rules and the majority averts their eyes, where does that leave us? Screwed, that’s where.

 

[Chew Toy McCoy]

We’ll find out how many cherish their democracy or don’t at some point.



What if they make it violent? Trump wanted martial law and the military told him to fuck off. What happens next time? When lies prevail, when truth means nothing and a majority does not care or a significant % can break all the rules and the majority averts their eyes, where does that leave us? Screwed, that’s where.

The right has been arming themselves with guns. The left has been arming themselves with moral authority participation trophies.

 

[SuperMatt]

There are effective non-violent means of demonstration. The civil rights movement in America during the mid-20th century comes to mind.

 

[Chew Toy McCoy]

There are effective non-violent means of demonstration. The civil rights movement in America during the mid-20th century comes to mind.

That was half a century ago. I couldn't tell you the last time demonstrations have been effective here...or waged against anything near Trumpism and partnering with a completely ineffective political party that is just as beholden to big money as the alternative. I think we are unparalleled times, at least in the US.

 

[Huntn]

There are effective non-violent means of demonstration. The civil rights movement in America during the mid-20th century comes to mind.

I’m not saying that is not possible, but when you have people in charge who view breaking rules as a path to continue to hold power, all bets are off.

 

[Chew Toy McCoy]

Listened to a discussion between 2 anti-Trump Republicans who when they pressed Trump supporters on exactly what it is they want it came down to essentially the same thing. The reason nobody can point to an exact period that America was great before is becuase it's different for everybody and it's largely tied to people's rose-colored memories of their childhood. For them, that is when America was last great. Basically they are mad the corner market from their childhood is now an Indian fusion restaurant.

They didn't mention this, but I think it's important to note that during your childhood you are pretty much responsibility-free and, short of being dirt poor or in an abusive family, the reason your childhood memories are so rose-colored is because you didn't have responsibilities weighing you down. So there's a good chance your memories are divorced from greater realities that weren't so great but didn't really affect you.

 

[SuperMatt]

That was half a century ago. I couldn't tell you the last time demonstrations have been effective here...or waged against anything near Trumpism and partnering with a completely ineffective political party that is just as beholden to big money as the alternative. I think we are unparalleled times, at least in the US.

So after only 50 years, humanity has changed so much that now violence is the only answer? Given the thousands of years of human existence, I find that hard to believe. That being said, we do resort to violence more often than we change things peacefully. Humanity has quite a penchant for violence.

 

[Chew Toy McCoy]

So after only 50 years, humanity has changed so much that now violence is the only answer? Given the thousands of years of human existence, I find that hard to believe. That being said, we do resort to violence more often than we change things peacefully. Humanity has quite a penchant for violence.

It might be a bit hyperbolic at this point, but fall of an empire? I can’t think of anybody looking to us for leadership at this point. We’re more like a spectacle of lunatics running the asylum.

Trump is the result of decades of failures of both parties, Republicans failure to tell their constituents the truth and Democrats failure to pass economic middle class and below legislation because it pissed off the rich and corporations. Of course there’s some exceptions in there, but not a lot. Some thought we would be ok because we had guardrails but Trump started removing them and the Republican party went “Wait, we can do that?” and thus far it looks like they can.

 

[Huntn]

It might be a bit hyperbolic at this point, but fall of an empire? I can’t think of anybody looking to us for leadership at this point. We’re more like a spectacle of lunatics running the asylum.

Trump is the result of decades of failures of both parties, Republicans failure to tell their constituents the truth and Democrats failure to pass economic middle class and below legislation because it pissed off the rich and corporations. Of course there’s some exceptions in there, but not a lot. Some thought we would be ok because we had guardrails but Trump started removing them and the Republican party went “Wait, we can do that?” and thus far it looks like they can.

One thing I don’t care for are equivalence arguments that try to make it sound like they are all alike. Not accusing you, unless you are specifically saying that they are, but there are distinct unrefutable differences that place Democrats on top of Republicans, and make them a better political party more suited to functioning in a democracy. Lieing and breaking rules for the win is unacceptable, and this is what we have in the Republican Party of 2016. . It’s undebatable.

So it can be said years of failure,but you can’t squeeze blood out of a turnip if you do not have a super majority of support to get things done.

 

[Chew Toy McCoy]

One thing I don’t care for are equivalence arguments that try to make it sound like they are all alike. Not accusing you, unless you are specifically saying that they are, but there are distinct unrefutable differences that place Democrats on top of Republicans, and make them a better political party more suited to functioning in a democracy. Lieing and breaking rules for the win is unacceptable, and this is what we have in the Republican Party of 2016. . It’s undebatable.

So it can be said years of failure,but you can’t squeeze blood out of a turnip if you do not have a super majority of support to get things done.

I'm not saying they are equal and the same, but I am saying if Democrats actually delivered on their promises, or I don't know, stopped catering to Wall St. and new big money, then they wouldn't have a razor-thin majority in Congress right now. If they can't get anything done then they are just a party of platitudes with a track record of doing the opposite of that. Manchin and Sinema don't explain away decades of failures, or maybe I should say wins for the ruling class but little for everybody else.

 

[SuperMatt]

I'm not saying they are equal and the same, but I am saying if Democrats actually delivered on their promises, or I don't know, stopped catering to Wall St. and new big money, then they wouldn't have a razor-thin majority in Congress right now. If they can't get anything done then they are just a party of platitudes with a track record of doing the opposite of that. Manchin and Sinema don't explain away decades of failures, or maybe I should say wins for the ruling class but little for everybody else.

Democrats should have more belief in progressive policies. They get into power and they start to believe “if we pass progressive policies, voters will hate us and switch to Republicans!” Then they pass watered-down policies or none at all, and then lose, and assume the tiny bit they moved the needle towards a better society is the reason they lost. In reality, it’s the fact they only passed a milquetoast version of the policy. Republicans will always say everything is too progressive, but when Dems lose, it‘s usually because of tepid turnout… the result of not passing the legislation their voters actually want. If every Democrat was like Sanders or Jayapal, we’d have universal healthcare by now.

 

[Chew Toy McCoy]

Democrats should have more belief in progressive policies. They get into power and they start to believe “if we pass progressive policies, voters will hate us and switch to Republicans!” Then they pass watered-down policies or none at all, and then lose, and assume the tiny bit they moved the needle towards a better society is the reason they lost. In reality, it’s the fact they only passed a milquetoast version of the policy. Republicans will always say everything is too progressive, but when Dems lose, it‘s usually because of tepid turnout… the result of not passing the legislation their voters actually want. If every Democrat was like Sanders or Jayapal, we’d have universal healthcare by now.

It seems like when Republicans have the opportunity they will pass whatever the hell they want with no regard to possible negative fallout. When Democrats have the opportunity they first micro analyze all the possible groups they could piss off to the point that it becomes inaction. I'm undecided if that is because they are that dense or are that corrupt, a la Manchin and Sinema.

I think Republican politicians were telling even bigger lies and excuses and their constituents were finally wising up. Unfortunately, they glommed unto an even bigger liar and excuse maker like a bunch of lie addicts who fell off the wagon when introduced to weapons-grade lies. I think Democrats are starting to wake up to their politicians' lies and excuses but I'm unsure where their allegiance will go as a result.

 

[SuperMatt]

It seems like when Republicans have the opportunity they will pass whatever the hell they want with no regard to possible negative fallout. When Democrats have the opportunity they first micro analyze all the possible groups they could piss off to the point that it becomes inaction. I'm undecided if that is because they are that dense or are that corrupt, a la Manchin and Sinema.

I think Republican politicians were telling even bigger lies and excuses and their constituents were finally wising up. Unfortunately, they glommed unto an even bigger liar and excuse maker like a bunch of lie addicts who fell off the wagon when introduced to weapons-grade lies. I think Democrats are starting to wake up to their politicians' lies and excuses but I'm unsure where their allegiance will go as a result.

What did Republicans pass (on the federal level) from 2017-2020? All I remember was a tax cut. That’s it. Their platform is “Washington is broken; keep government out of our lives!” It’s easy to pass nothing, and convincing their voters that doing so is a good thing is a triumph of advertising and brainwashing.

 

[Chew Toy McCoy]

What did Republicans pass (on the federal level) from 2017-2020? All I remember was a tax cut. That’s it. Their platform is “Washington is broken; keep government out of our lives!” It’s easy to pass nothing, and convincing their voters that doing so is a good thing is a triumph of advertising and brainwashing.

I probably should have included brick wall obstruction in my statement about Republicans, but there was also the supreme court appointee they fast-tracked through when they successfully blocked Obama from doing the same with a lot more left to go on his presidency. And they couldn't give less of a shit about the blatant hypocrisy of it. I can't say Democrats would do the same in a similar situation. They'd probably take some "that's not what you do in a civilized society" stance.

 

[SuperMatt]

I probably should have included brick wall obstruction in my statement about Republicans, but there was also the supreme court appointee they fast-tracked through when they successfully blocked Obama from doing the same with a lot more left to go on his presidency. And they couldn't give less of a shit about the blatant hypocrisy of it. I can't say Democrats would do the same in a similar situation. They'd probably take some "that's not what you do in a civilized society" stance.

Court nominees are not laws. I’m talking about actually doing something. And not all nominees end up being what you think… Justice Roberts is starting to side with the “liberal” judges more and more often as time goes on.

The Republican method is MUCH easier to accomplish, since it involves no new ideas, or taking a risk passing any laws… just sit on your butts for your term, making connections with the wealthy so you can get positions on corporate boards or making speeches or consulting for millions when you get out.

 

[Chew Toy McCoy]

Court nominees are not laws. I’m talking about actually doing something. And not all nominees end up being what you think… Justice Roberts is starting to side with the “liberal” judges more and more often as time goes on.

The Republican method is MUCH easier to accomplish, since it involves no new ideas, or taking a risk passing any laws… just sit on your butts for your term, making connections with the wealthy so you can get positions on corporate boards or making speeches or consulting for millions when you get out.

Not disagreeing that it’s easier to just block everything, but they are also deferring to the state level…all kinds of voter supression laws and gerrymandering and I haven’t heard peep lately on the Texas abortion ban. Doesn’t matter who has harder work to do. Republicans are getting what they want done.

 

[SuperMatt]

Not disagreeing that it’s easier to just block everything, but they are also deferring to the state level…all kinds of voter supression laws and gerrymandering and I haven’t heard peep lately on the Texas abortion ban. Doesn’t matter who has harder work to do. Republicans are getting what they want done.

Yep, they screwed themselves with the abortion ban. 2/3‘s of people don’t want abortion banned. They should have stayed with their “block everything” strategy, because abortion being illegal is going to energize the left, while at the same time, the ”pro-life” folks don’t have motivation because they already got what they wanted. They never really wanted an abortion ban. What they wanted was a wedge issue to turn out voters. This is going to backfire big-time, I think. It should motivate local and state races too: do you want the GOP to take over your state and ban abortion? If not, you’d better get off your ass and get to the polls.

Without an exception for rape, it is (sadly) only a matter of time before somebody is raped and unable to get an abortion because 6 weeks passed. That is going to hit every news outlet in the world, and make Republicans look like garbage. The bigger question is: if most Republicans are older and addicted to Facebook and Fox, will they even know what happened?

 

[Huntn]

I'm not saying they are equal and the same, but I am saying if Democrats actually delivered on their promises, or I don't know, stopped catering to Wall St. and new big money, then they wouldn't have a razor-thin majority in Congress right now. If they can't get anything done then they are just a party of platitudes with a track record of doing the opposite of that. Manchin and Sinema don't explain away decades of failures, or maybe I should say wins for the ruling class but little for everybody else.

Democrats should have more belief in progressive policies. They get into power and they start to believe “if we pass progressive policies, voters will hate us and switch to Republicans!” Then they pass watered-down policies or none at all, and then lose, and assume the tiny bit they moved the needle towards a better society is the reason they lost. In reality, it’s the fact they only passed a milquetoast version of the policy. Republicans will always say everything is too progressive, but when Dems lose, it‘s usually because of tepid turnout… the result of not passing the legislation their voters actually want. If every Democrat was like Sanders or Jayapal, we’d have universal healthcare by now.

This situation exists Imo because we are teetering on a ball with basically halves of the country pulling in opposite directions. The democrats do not have a comfortable majority at all, barely have a majority, and with the hard core corrupt Republican inspired gerrymandering going on that will most likely eliminate that Democratic majority in 2022, which btw is kind of making me lose my mind, (I think we are going to Hell literally), the democrats in Congress don’t have carte blanche to do anything including 2 sinister DINOS fucking up their agenda, so it’s absolutely NO SURPRISE they are having difficulty getting their agenda passed.

There is a feeling that if we all get ourselves voted out, there will be no progressive agenda period which is also mixed in with political survival instincts, but that does not make the sentiment any less true.

How can anyone be mad at the democrats if you see the situation clearly? If you want to be mad, there are a great number of citizens who are just too stupid, too selfish, not engaged or don’t give a damn to recognize the dire straights Democracy is in within the United States In 2021. That’s on the collective us.

And there is an angry philosophical part of me that says if we are too stupid, then fuck us, we deserve the shit headed our way, what better way to learn a lesson, after the fact, finally recognizing your country has turned into a fascist state. There will be plenty of time for boo hoos and self reflection afterwards.

And there is hardcore shit going on such as the law passed in Georgia allowing a board of elections to be replaced by the legislature is the kind of shit that will cause this country to unravel.

MSN

www.msn.com

How do you deal with a political party that has broken bad? The only way out is to elect more democrats or start a revolution.

 

[Chew Toy McCoy]

This situation exists Imo because we are teetering on a ball with basically halves of the country pulling in opposite directions. The democrats do not have a comfortable majority at all, barely have a majority, and with the hard core corrupt Republican inspired gerrymandering going on that will most likely eliminate that Democratic majority in 2022, which btw is kind of making me lose my mind, (I think we are going to Hell literally), the democrats in Congress don’t have carte blanche to do anything including 2 sinister DINOS fucking up their agenda, so it’s absolutely NO SURPRISE they are having difficulty getting their agenda passed.

There is a feeling that if we all get ourselves voted out, there will be no progressive agenda period which is also mixed in with political survival instincts, but that does not make the sentiment any less true.

How can anyone be mad at the democrats if you see the situation clearly? If you want to be mad, there are a great number of citizens who are just too stupid, too selfish, not engaged or don’t give a damn to recognize the dire straights Democracy is in within the United States In 2021. That’s on the collective us.

And there is an angry philosophical part of me that says if we are too stupid, then fuck us, we deserve the shit headed our way, what better way to learn a lesson, after the fact, finally recognizing your country has turned into a fascist state. There will be plenty of time for boo hoos and self reflection afterwards.

And there is hardcore shit going on such as the law passed in Georgia allowing a board of elections to be replaced by the legislature is the kind of shit that will cause this country to unravel.

MSN

www.msn.com

How do you deal with a political party that has broken bad? The only way out is to elect more democrats or start a revolution.

If authoritarian Trumpism takes over I’m curious what solutions they are actually going to offer that actually work. Trump is an idiot but those on the right who have been in politics for a while are well aware that they’ve been offering scapegoats for decades that aren’t the actual cause of the problems. If they somehow eliminated those scapegoats it still wouldn’t solve anything. The greed they’ve funneled to the top for decades has also made things substantially worse. I fail to see how violence and a police state isn’t going to be a serious component of their control. It’s the only thing left in their toolbox when they don’t have solutions based on reality and as defenders of the rich reality is their enemy.

 

[Huntn]

If authoritarian Trumpism takes over I’m curious what solutions they are actually going to offer that actually work. Trump is an idiot but those on the right who have been in politics for a while are well aware that they’ve been offering scapegoats for decades that aren’t the actual cause of the problems. If they somehow eliminated those scapegoats it still wouldn’t solve anything. The greed they’ve funneled to the top for decades has also made things substantially worse. I fail to see how violence and a police state isn’t going to be a serious component of their control. It’s the only thing left in their toolbox when they don’t have solutions based on reality and as defenders of the rich reality is their enemy.

The entirety of this post is based on a political party, the Republicans who no longer respect the law or the spirit of our Constitution. I’m not predicting this will happen, but it seems to be a distinct possibility in our near future Based soley on how the GOP has morphed into the Party of Trump, and whatever you can get away with is ok by them.

We either have leadership who honors and follows the law in good faith or they are a bunch of corrupt, back stabbing MoFos, get away with whatever you can with the support of their base, and who’s intent is to hold power at all costs. Then it becomes might makes right, fuck the law, and any obstacle to my holding power. Exaggeration? The signs are there, that this is the game at the State level.

Worst case…
As long as a majority are in control or comfortable, we will watch our liberties dissolve, real liberties, not the Right Wing my liber-tay to walk over you bull shit, but things like voters rights, equality under the law, and free speech, and people in jail just because they represent a threat to the regime.

When the fascists sieze control, at some point the seizing might trigger large scale violence, but maybe not. This woukd have to be where due process goes out the window, and it’s going to take significant numbers of people to start suffering before we ever see a revolution.

Of course what do I know? If Trump comes back because the election was actually stolen, who knows, the military could stage a coup. At this point between a corrupt Trump government (based on a stolen election) and a military coup with the promise of returning to Democracy, what would you choose? It would be a difficult choice.

And Revolution is a tough choice anyway because it could mean a lot of ”Haves” lose everything they’ve got, including their lives.