2020 Presidential Election, The Day After

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Huntn

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Four years ago, the question was asked: Just how bad can he be? 👀

The Answer: The God Awful WORST Incompetence and Poison, a National Embarrassment, turning MAGA into a sick, xenophobic, homophobic, misogynist joke from someone who spewed hate, division, and the unique brand of Donny’s Best Ever Snake Oil, guaranteed to curdled your heart and soul, and send you on a trip into your own self absorbed fantasy world where your base nature strangles the goodness in your heart.

And four years later, a majority of Americans decided that enough is enough. The victory is sweet! Approval for removing this Malignancy in January is a GO, HURRAH! 🌈🎊🏄‍♂️⚡🌟💥😭

But look at the numbers. 70 Million people voted for the more of the malignancy. WHY?

People, unless Congressional Republicans have a come to Jesus Moment, the struggle is not over. Half the country wanted the tumor. Democrats/Liberals have a mountain of work before them. If Mitch McConnell is still the Senate Majority leader, he will do all he can to disrupt any Democratic Agenda.

And then you have to ask, how can half of the Nation, working class citizens, embrace the Republican Agenda, going as far as tolerating deceit, misdirection, and a wide variety falsehoods, because they see something the Republicans offer. Is it religion, homophobia, abortion, do they think they will be better financially under Republican rule, or both? This is the question, and it is what the Democrats will have 2 years to figure out before the next Mid term election.

For myself there is no question, Moderate/Left is the path forward, and Right/Conservative is the past. Conservatism has always been about holding on to what I have. Many of you know I’m a firm believer of WE>ME, a corner stone of liberalism.

What do you think?
 
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rdrr

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Too soon to start talking about Cabinet and staff?

Hillary or Merrick Garland for AG
Mayor Pete for Chief of Staff
 

despondentdiver

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One can hope. The trifecta of Trump being gone, having to put out with Brexit, and his poor management of the covid crisis all in a short span of time is going to take a toll on his government. I just hope Labour manages not to fuck it up in the next election (which will likely be my first one voting here, as I just got my settled status last week 🎉).

Thank you America indeed: with Biden in the White House Johnson will need to compromise with his deal as he won't have Trump to help him. The effects of having Trump out (before he even gets out!) are already far reaching.
@Huntn

Great thread.

I shall return to it tomorrow.

Right now? This Brit is celebrating as if Boris Johnson got kicked out.

This is a start, though.

Thank you America!
 

Scepticalscribe

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@Huntn

Great thread.

I shall return to it tomorrow.

Right now? This Brit is celebrating as if Boris Johnson got kicked out.

This is a start, though.

Thank you America!

Yes: Exactly. This scribe is celebrating as well.

I have actually enjoyed cooking this evening. Enjoyed, pottering around the kitchen preparing vegetarian tom yum (with organic goodies from the farmers' market) soup and basmati rice - busy simmering away as I write.
 

Arkitect

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despondentdiver

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I was thinking, and you know what the worst part of it is? The margins have been so thin that if Trump had just let the experts do their job and deal with the pandemic, he would have most certainly cruised to a big victory. He would still be incompetent, cruel, ignorant, and that would have been good enough for many millions of Americans. But he couldn't even do that, he had to micromanage experts with decades of experience, and it cost (at least) a quarter million lives, and in an ironic twist of fate, it cost him this election.

Anyway, soon he'll be gone, so there's that.
 
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Scepticalscribe

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This is also the time an eye has to be kept laser focused on this asshat. He's petty & vengeful, besides being selfish.

We have no idea what this turd will do to set himself up once he realizes the presidency isn't his shield anymore.

Yes, he needs to be closely watched between now and January.

And, given his vindictive and destructive nature, I'm not sure how he can be made accountable to anyone, unless his won party tries for a belated attempt at political respectability and actually removes him from office, installing Pence, before January.
 

despondentdiver

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Yes, he needs to be closely watched between now and January.

And, given his vindictive and destructive nature, I'm not sure how he can be made accountable to anyone, unless his won party tries for a belated attempt at political respectability and actually removes him from office, installing Pence, before January.
They won't.

Like Walsh said in one of his recent podcasts, he's been told by many of his former colleagues in the GOP that everyone was hoping he'd get crushed in the election so they could just turn the page but unfortunately, this election was a rejection of Trump, but a victory of Trumpism. His grip over the GOP voters is quasi total. If he decides to run in 2024, he'll win the primaries unchallenged, otherwise, the candidate will be whoever he anoints as his successor (it's likely to be Ivanka).

I also think that there's a high chance he'll flee the country so as to avoid facing prosecution, and he'll become a martyr in exile. From there, he could mobilise an enormous amount of voters in the most powerful country.

He'll go, but he won't go away.
 

Scepticalscribe

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They won't.

Like Walsh said in one of his recent podcasts, he's been told by many of his former colleagues in the GOP that everyone was hoping he'd get crushed in the election so they could just turn the page but unfortunately, this election was a rejection of Trump, but a victory of Trumpism. His grip over the GOP voters is quasi total. If he decides to run in 2024, he'll win the primaries unchallenged, otherwise, the candidate will be whoever he anoints as his successor (it's likely to be Ivanka).

I also think that there's a high chance he'll flee the country so as to avoid facing prosecution, and he'll become a martyr in exile. From there, he could mobilise an enormous amount of voters in the most powerful country.

He'll go, but he won't go away.

I can't see any way for Mr Trump himself to run again in 2024; when all of the votes are counted, this will be shown to have been a comprehensive defeat, with Mr Trump losing the popular vote not once, but twice.

Remember, Mr Biden has polled the greatest number of votes ever, in an election for the US presidency, and - eventually - he will be shown to have carries the Electoral College quite comfortably.

Now, someone could well emerge to attempt to craft - and appeal - to Mr Trump's constituency, but it will have to widen its appeal to more than alienated white males, some white women, and Latinos who bought into the message about how a Biden administration was supposed to equal communism.

However, whatever about history, demographics are not on their side, which means that their attempts at voter suppression - which were historically comprehensive, yet didn't work, - will have to become even more stratospheric next time.

I think that Mr Trump may face charges and will also face debts falling due; it will be interesting to see who is willing to side with him as the tide of power ebbs away from him. Those who prioritise transactional relationships in their lives find themselves with little left when they have nothing worthwhile left to transact.
 

lizkat

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The day after. Even the crazies are throwing in the towel.

But they are still insane. This insane:


Well Schmidt saying that is certainly not to suggest that the Lincoln Project would back Tucker Carlson.

He's more saying that the Trump crazies are not going away, and that it's just too damn late to try to resurrect a party that once included Eisenhower, Javits, Lugar.. and one that inexplicably now will swear in a Marjorie Taylor Greene in 2021. She and the likes of Louis Gohmert and Devin Nunes deserve to try to figure out together who's on first around that wacky campfire.

The never Trumpers, moderate Republicans who reluctantly became indies and any rational conservatives out there in voterland are gonna have to float a new banner and let the old GOP finish digging its grave.
 

despondentdiver

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I know what you mean, but for once I think you're mistaken. When it comes to Trump, none of the logical assumptions that a sane person such as yourself could imagine would work. A couple of days ago Walsh put it much better than I could (and he's been consistently right when it comes to predicting the behaviour of the Trump cult), but it boils down to this: for his supporters, Trump hasn't lost, he's won the election, and Biden committed fraud and stole it away from him. For them, the pandemic hasn't even happened, and Trump is the greatest president in the history of the world. What you disregard as the antics of a petulant man-child who refuses to behave, for them it is the word of God.

A good example of how logic doesn't apply to these people, is that in 2016 he got 63 million votes (to Hillary's 65.9). This time around he got 70.5 million. That's 7.5 million more. 7.5 million people who saw what he did for four years, and then they listened to Hannity and Carlson and all the others pretty much every waking hour, and they decided to join the cult. Propaganda is powerful, and the GOP created a monster that they now depend on, so they are going to have to keep the symbiosis alive.

This time around Biden had the support of many decent republicans and libertarians put off by Trump, but he is bound to make mistakes, and once the honeymoon period is over, things will change very quickly. In other words, Biden had many voters loaned to him, but Trump owns outright almost all of his voters, no matter what.

On the upside, Trump will be 78 by then, so there's a high chance he himself won't be able to run, but he might designate Ivanka as his successor and that would be just as bad. A republican-controlled senate will sabotage any attempts by Biden to make significant improvements to the country, and the Murdoch media machine will have four years to create a cult around Trump's successor. Remember, this last election, in the key states, the margin has often been <100K votes (in some it's <5000 votes). In a hypothetical 2024 run, an Ivanka/Carlson ticket would have all 70 million of Trump's voters whereas the democrats would certainly lose the support of some of their temporary voters, and any internal struggle would reduce that number even further.

There are too many unknowns left (what charges he'll face, whether or not he'll stay in the US, whether he'll get convicted, etc) to make any predictions, but it would be wise not to be too confident, we know all too well what happened in 2016. I don't think Trump will be that much of an anomaly looking forward unless effective action is taken to eliminate the electoral college, gerrymandering, voter suppression, disinformation, etc.

Anyway, sorry for all the gloom. Today is a happy day.


I can't see any way for Mr Trump himself to run again in 2024; when all of the votes are counted, this will be shown to have been a comprehensive defeat, with Mr Trump losing the popular vote not once, but twice.

Remember, Mr Biden has polled the greatest number of votes ever, in an election for the US presidency, and - eventually - he will be shown to have carries the Electoral College quite comfortably.

Now, someone could well emerge to attempt to craft - and appeal - to Mr Trump's constituency, but it will have to widen its appeal to more than alienated white males, some white women, and Latinos who bought into the message about how a Biden administration was supposed to equal communism.

However, whatever about history, demographics are not on their side, which means that their attempts at voter suppression - which were historically comprehensive, yet didn't work, - will have to become even more stratospheric next time.

I think that Mr Trump may face charges and will also face debts falling due; it will be interesting to see who is willing to side with him as the tide of power ebbs away from him. Those who prioritise transactional relationships in their lives find themselves with little left when they have nothing worthwhile left to transact.
 
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lizkat

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I don't think Trump will be that much of an anomaly looking forward unless effective action is taken to eliminate the electoral college, gerrymandering, voter suppression etc.

got that right... no matter who manages to become the Pied Piper of that part of the American electorate.

That's why we have to keep in mind that changing a party's way of operating has to be maintained at the grass roots.

School boards, town councils, those went to Republican hands one election at a time starting in the 1990s when Buchanan and Gingrich were amping up the culture wars.

We only thought the Reagan era (with his then shocking remarks about "welfare queens" etc) was a four alarm fire bell ringing in our ears....

Sure some local races and local legislatures have been flipped blue since Trump landed in the Oval Office, and it's been because of progressives rolling up sleeves and bothering to put candidates on tickets that lots of times didn't even have any opposition to long-term R incumbents. It's been a great start. But we can't quit making that level of effort.

There are still so many Republican governors and Republican state legislatures... and they are who do stuff like appoint Senators in event of vacancies, and draw the Congressional District maps off new census info every ten years.

The Democrats still tend to think in terms of what their star power is and how to keep attention on those names. Well those celebrity photo ops at media-attended events just don't trickle down to the level of Democratic Party bench building. The people living in small towns and rural areas couldn't give less of a damn about celebrity pols much less how well crafted their "message" is.

The message that matters is the one from the voters to the pols... at the polling place. And it's about "what i think of what you have DONE lately."

Every small town resident knows some jackass who talks a lot at town meetings but is never found in the church hall or firehall meeting room holding a saw or a screwdriver during renovations or a pancake turner at the fundraisers.

The only photo ops that count in small towns and rural areas are the ones where someone DID SOMETHING to help and is standing next to it with some of the volunteers and $5 donors for the local paper's photog to get a picture.

A new skateboard park. New steps and a ramp for the library to make it more accessible... and an add-on room to house special events meant to attract kids and keep them coming back to the library as a place to have fun and learn at the same time. A referral center converted from a disused property on Main Street instead of out in the boondocks where no person desperately needing counseling or a treatment referral could likely even get to the place.

It's easy to kick dirt at the DNC and I don't mind doing it even now... but my point today is more about how it was voters who gave Donald Trump a fat pink slip, and it was local people one by one kicking in $5 or making a phone call or printing up posters at demos and so forth who got people to register and to vote. And voters who get ticked off at the no-opposition tickets on ballots and who encourage competent colleagues or kin or friends to run for local public offices.

So it's us... not "them" at the top of the DNC or a state committee who have to keep this thing going. We cannot sit back now and just hang out until suddenly it's midterm elections time and we start wondering if the House might flip red or something. Sure it might flip red if we sit around if that's what we want to let happen... so we can resume complaining?

But I'm going to assume we all give ourselves permission to sit around this weekend, unless we're Democratic Party lawyers or ACLU wonks working the margins of a transition that could get illegal before it gets friendly.

Me I'm making a whole new set of playlists from songs I ain't played in a long time now. Hope everyone has a great weekend. If there's bad news afoot, "save it"... 🤩🥳🤩🥳🤩🥳
 
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