ICE Vehicles: General topics

[Herdfan]

It's amazing how much like a computer vehicles have become, I spent this weekend "updating the cars", both, one to correct a few things, including the backup lines, and another that was an incremental update to fine tune a few things on the way to a much more major update. The Tesla is especially like this since updates roll out brand new media features, UI changes, etc.

I have an OBD2 adapter that allows me to hook up and change some functions on my F-250. For example, the turn signal has 2 settings. A simple push makes it blink 3 times for changing lanes or if you push past the detent it holds until you return the wheel to straight (normal turn signal). I didn't think the 3 blinks was enough so I set it at 7. Also killed the annoying "Ding" when the door is open and the engine running.

Still I was so impressed by having a "real" heater in my 1980 Datsun later on: I used to turn the heat on during a summer evening ride back from town sometimes, just to feel hot air kick in after a minute. The VW gave off heat only after its engine got hot, which meant in winter I never really had a warm ride home from the grocery store in town in the dead of winter. Good times.

My new truck has the electric supplemental heater so I have heat as soon as I want it. Last truck didn't have it, but the one before it did. And I missed it. That big diesel takes forever to heat up. I could use the engine block heater to help, but that was too much trouble.

 

[JohnR]

Well, if anyone was considering the Chevy Bolt, I would hold off for awhile:

GM expands battery recall to ALL 2017-2022 Chevy Bolt EVs including EUV, blames supplier LG

GM Friday afternoon announced it would expand its Bolt recall to ALL Chevy Bolts including ones manufactured in the US...

electrek.co

 

[SuperMatt]

It's amazing how much like a computer vehicles have become, I spent this weekend "updating the cars", both, one to correct a few things, including the backup lines, and another that was an incremental update to fine tune a few things on the way to a much more major update. The Tesla is especially like this since updates roll out brand new media features, UI changes, etc.

This is something that really puts me off from getting a Tesla. Their self-driving module freaked out around lights from emergency vehicles and crashed in multiple instances. That doesn’t inspire confidence in their software. So do I want them updating it all the time? If a software update screws up my PC, it’s an annoyance. If it screws up my car, it could be life-threatening.

The idea of waking up to a software update gone wrong on my car does NOT appeal to me. Just what I need - they borked a software update and now I cannot get the car to start so how do I get to work? Or I head out the driveway and notice something is screwed up with the steering or brakes… No thanks.

 

[DT]

@SuperMatt

Yeah, I hear you, it runs through my head on occasion as an owner (and did as a prospective buyer). My buddy who is a software engineer like me, very early adopter (I want to say since around 2016), he's never had an issue (on his 3rd and 4th Teslas). Though he's a lot like us, works from home, has a pretty thorough perspective on the potential downsides vs. the benefits, etc.

It's funny, Tesla is quite a bit like Apple ...

Led by a bit of a loose canon, but clearly incredibly bright CEO (talking Jobs vs. Musk), they're priced high-er-ish as a kind of "boutique package" product (the value is in the software), they sometimes stumble with "improvements" that really aren't, i.e., the "We'll tell you what you want and you'll like it ..." type product design philosophy. They're both a bit of a walled garden, have massive value, spend cycles on seemingly pointless efforts, and they're both very broad with their vision, i.e., Tesla isn't a "car company" and Apple isn't a "computer company"/

When they're right, when they skate where the puck will be, it's genius (iPod, Model 3), when they're not, it's disastrously bad (Hockey puck mouse, steering yoke).

 

[JohnR]

I don't think the yoke is that bad...wish I had it on my Y

 

[JohnR]

This is something that really puts me off from getting a Tesla. Their self-driving module freaked out around lights from emergency vehicles and crashed in multiple instances. That doesn’t inspire confidence in their software. So do I want them updating it all the time? If a software update screws up my PC, it’s an annoyance. If it screws up my car, it could be life-threatening.

The idea of waking up to a software update gone wrong on my car does NOT appeal to me. Just what I need - they borked a software update and now I cannot get the car to start so how do I get to work? Or I head out the driveway and notice something is screwed up with the steering or brakes… No thanks.

out of 200,000+ Tesla cars on the road, you are talking about ~20 or less? I have never had an incident even remotely close to that nor do I know of any of my members (I'm the president of the KY owners club with 400+ members) reporting such thing. To worry about it is your choice, but not mine.

As for a software update gone wrong....again, never happened nor have I heard of it happening anywhere. Tesla has an Early Access Program where they invite you to join and they will occasionally update your car with new software. Plus, they test out the software before release. AND it's not released widely all at once. I have gone a month or more before my car is updated, yet a buddy of mine in same city gets his practically the day they release it.

But hey, at least they aren't catching fire like the Bolt, have death wobbles like the Ford F250, the multiple recalls on the Escape when it first came out, etc. Perhaps Tesla isn't for you, that's fine. But talk to actual owners before making decisions based upon what you wrote up there.

 

[DT]

I don't think the yoke is that bad...wish I had it on my Y

It's a terrible idea on a street car, and even if it was something they wanted to move to, don't do it till you have [speed] variable steering ratio (with user adjustability).

 

[JohnR]

It's a terrible idea on a street car, and even if it was something they wanted to move to, don't do it till you have [speed] variable steering ratio (with user adjustability).

I'm hoping to get to drive a plaid S soon and will give my opinion of the yoke.

 

[DT]

I'm hoping to get to drive a plaid S soon and will give my opinion of the yoke.

I've actually driven a couple of vehicles with a yoke, one was a street-ish car (challenge F-car) and was an outright track-only car (open wheeled Mazda), and they're great on track, but would not be in a parking lot, etc. The other issue is where Tesla decided to locate the horn button, which rotates out of use during slow speed, full lock turns.

Again, it's probably fun one you're up and running, around town, in a parking lot, garages, etc., yikes.

The problem is, it solves a problem that doesn't exist, i.e., impairing the visibility of the dashboard - at least that's been the justification behind the design coming out of Tesla. That's why it would be extra pointless in a Y or a 3, since there's no dash to block The solution to info on the dash possibly being blocked by the wheel in an S and X, and the lack of front of driver data in the 3 and Y could __all__ be solved by a HUD.

 

[User.168]

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[JohnR]

I can’t find what I was looking for so I will have to paraphrase:
I *think* that another benefit of the yoke is that it forces the driver to place hands at 9 & 3 position, which is the new (to me at least) position that is recommended for to the airbags. Having your hand on the top actually would cause your face to be hit by it if you crashed and the bag deployed. (Again, I am no expert but this is how I see it)
I will ask current owners what they think

I do know that someone has said they wished the turn signals were tactile instead? And perhaps they were separated left and right sides.

 

[JohnR]

Unfortunately they have been known to catch fire too

https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2021/08/04/tesla-fire/

Love how that article uses a tweet out of context making it seem as if Elon is talking about a software update to prevent fires.
He was actually talking about the class action suit alleging Tesla’s software causes their battery to have less range.

anyway, yeah, it is unfortunate and those are ongoing investigations probably. I have no knowledge on what May have cause them.
But GM has placed blame on LG. Read the article.

 

[DT]

I can’t find what I was looking for so I will have to paraphrase:
I *think* that another benefit of the yoke is that it forces the driver to place hands at 9 & 3 position, which is the new (to me at least) position that is recommended for to the airbags. Having your hand on the top actually would cause your face to be hit by it if you crashed and the bag deployed. (Again, I am no expert but this is how I see it)

The problem with the 9 & 3 idea, is during any turn past some X°, your arms are going to cross - right in front of the airbag - where with a round wheel, I can easily shuffle steer and keep my arms out of the way.

It's not a great idea.

Heck, the wheel in my TM3 is fantastic, just the right diameter, nice and thick, even the bottom is slightly flattened like a real performance car

The new Model S (QA issues notwithstanding) is excellent, the Plaid flavor is insanely awesome, there's a lot to like about it, I imagine for people who decide to purchase the new S, for them, the yoke will fall somewhere between an ambivalent "it's OK" and an enthusiastic, but partially confirmation biased delusion of "it's the greatest thing ever"

I guess the real test would've been to offer both the yoke and a round wheel, see what the uptake was on the former (and track any "returns" - so to speak - for the other wheel).

 

[User.168]

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[DT]

@bunnspecial ...

It’s a not a new fad or anything, but it’s more of a low tone melodramatic color that’s not very eye-popping, but has a unique shade to it.

 

[tobefirst]

I'm a big fan of Doug Demuro's. Sometimes his videos are too long for me, but, ohmygosh, I'm glad I watched this one on the Plaid. I've linked directly to his test drive, which is what made it so worth it for me.

 

[DT]

@tobefirst

Hahaha, yeah, his reaction shots are alone are worth a watch He's pretty spot on - killer tech, unrivaled acceleration, solid general design/creature-comforts vs. decent-ish driving dynamics and a crap shoot of mediocrity when comes to build quality/QA/etc.

You have to decide if the former vs. the latter when compared to the price is worth it.

I mean, my M3P is a ~$55K 4-door, performance sedan and at that price point, given the performance, tech, etc., and the current market when comparing it to over $55K cars in the segment, it's a deal (with the $7500 FTC it would've been an insane bargain, maybe we'll still see something) and I got a really good one. For someone in my income range, if it was used regularly, the gas savings would be notable as well.

When you start getting over $75K, $100K, $125K, the car has to bring another level to things, the cost starts diluting the performance - or - it's a $138K parlor trick (that might be worth it ) Don't know if you heard him say the owner has "several other high end cars like Ferraris" ...

One thing I was surprised by: no dead digs, all his acceleration hits were from a roll (looked to be around 35-45-ish), I suspect that was by request of the owner for whatever reason.

 

[Huntn]

I’m looking for some advice. My grandson is saving up for a car, we know how crazy the used car market currently is. He’s looking at a 2016 Subaru BRZ, 6 speed manual, 50k miles for $10k. Here is the catch, it has a salvage/rebuilt title. It was crashed in 2020, the front end repaired, declared totaled by the insurance company (looked at the Car Fax Report). It has current tags on it. The equivalent car “not formerly crashed” goes for about $20k.

My impression is that with a rebuilt title value can be questionable, as in you have to find someone willing to buy it. For such a car is $10k a reasonable price?

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We drove it today. It looks good, looks good under the hood, and drives good. My plan is prior to purchase, to pay my mechanic to run it up on lift and look for issues like a rewelded frame, and plug the computer into it looking for issues. I think there is a place I can plug in the VIN and see if it’s in the system. Anything else? Is this a good deal, or possibly be a good deal? If it was me I would not be going anywhere need a rebuilt totaled car.

 

[SuperMatt]

I’m looking for some advice. My grandson is saving up for a car, we know how crazy the used car market currently is. He’s looking at a 2016 Subaru BRZ, 6 speed manual, 50k miles for $10k. Here is the catch, it has a salvage/rebuilt title. It was crashed in 2020, the front end repaired, declared totaled by the insurance company (looked at the Car Fax Report). It has current tags on it. The equivalent car “not formerly crashed” goes for about $20k.

My impression is that with a rebuilt title value can be questionable, as in you have to find someone willing to buy it. For such a car is $10k a reasonable price?

View attachment 8355​

We drove it today. It looks good, looks good under the hood, and drives good. My plan is prior to purchase, to pay my mechanic to run it up on lift and look for issues like a rewelded frame, and plug the computer into it looking for issues. I think there is a place I can plug in the VIN and see if it’s in the system. Anything else? Is this a good deal, or possibly be a good deal? If it was me I would not be going anywhere need a rebuilt totaled car.

Somebody crashing a sporty car like this was probably driving like a bat out of hell and trashing the engine too.

 

[Herdfan]

I’m looking for some advice. My grandson is saving up for a car, we know how crazy the used car market currently is. He’s looking at a 2016 Subaru BRZ, 6 speed manual, 50k miles for $10k. Here is the catch, it has a salvage/rebuilt title.

Not sure how the laws in your state are, but in WV a salvage title and reconstructed title are two different things. If you have a salvage title and want to convert it to a reconstructed title, you must have it inspected by one of about 12 shops throughout the state licensed to do those inspections. And it might not pass. If it does, you will forever have a reconstructed title vs a regular title. Probably worth it if you are saving half.