A case for Trump supporters

[SuperMatt]

If people thought Trump's rhetoric was just a lot of hot air in 2016, I can accept them voting for him although I disagree. In 2020, when we KNOW he bans muslims from coming to America, tears kids from their parents and locks them in cages, calls for BLM protesters to be shot, uses government resources to bribe Ukrainian officials for dirt on Hunter Biden, and on and on and on, I cannot give them the benefit of the doubt. If they are not racist, they at least don't mind that he is. If they personally don't dislike Mexicans, they certainly have no problem with locking Mexican babies in cages. They support religious freedom, but don't mind it being stolen from Muslims? Sorry, if the only thing you care about is "the economy" and are willing to watch 250K fellow citizens die to keep it humming, or you only care about "stop abortion" but let babies be stolen from their moms..... sorry, I just don't have empathy for you.

 

[Eric]

Which is why I included the picture at the end. It's literally how the phrase begins...

"I'm not saying all 45 supporters are racist..."

It isn't saying ALL 45 supporters, it isn't saying ALL 70 million people are racists.

It's saying that for ALL 70 million people racism isn't an issue for them.

Despite it being an issue for an ever growing population of the United States.

That's NOT partisan. That's reality, and that's the fear being stoked by the party of 45.

The sooner that's recognized & acknowledged, the better.

To rephrase

That group that doesn't care about you, will turn on you at the first chance. We've even seen in this group they will support a man & his party that is actively working to throw them off of needed health insurance. Because that group has brought party rhetoric over their own survival, at the benefit of those who can easily afford their own insurance. At some point it has to be realized that some groups of people will NOT accept you. Sad as it maybe, but true.

You can't help everyone, especially if they don't want to be helped. You can work with those who do share your goals to make a world that does help everyone, even those that will actively seek to stymie your efforts so that only a few they prefer are helped.

It seems that it could also be that racism isn't a top issue for most of them, the same could be said for the virus or sexual assault, IMO it's baffling that anyone could ever vote this man, let alone over 70 million. But it's also hard to overlook such a massive number and what they see in him.

It seems like it's more an ideal than a person (Trump) like the tea party was back in the Obama days, they had a voice and an uprising, albeit not enough to win an election (with the exception of 2016). While we are actively engaged in partisan politics here and elsewhere, as are many Republicans, I think it's easy to overlook all of those in the middle who look at a bigger picture rather than wedge issues.

 

[Huntn]

I’m actually waiting to see what the never-Trump Republicans do next. Their party is a mess, and unless they start working hard to win it back, they will need to create a new Party of Lincoln.

The real shame of this is that we don’t have a proportional representation that might improve things greatly vs 48%-70% of the Country being disenfranchised. A system that actually represents the interests of the various demographics that exist in the country.

So while a third party would be embraced, as good for democracy, it’s still winner take all, and one of those party’s would be a cult based on embracing corruption, and a maladjusted, megalomaniac, sociopath, POS Conman.

 

[User.45]

I rest my case
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1327798764334182400/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1327696933968896001/
That right there epitomizes why 45 has supporters. They are just like him. If they aren't the only ones winning, the contest was unfair. It's always the fault of others if they aren't winning, so it's time to go out, blame others, and accuse them of the very things they do. They will whine if others succeed where they don't & create any number of fictions why, after screaming others want "participation awards" for pointing out the basic imbalances intentionally built into our society.

Remember, it took until just recently for the news media to finally acknowledge what some of these nutjobs are, NOT the patriotic romantic sounding 'militia' for their violent acts, but finally the well earned "domestic terrorist". The same label that was quickly tried & trotted out for groups that only came into being with this administration ANTIFA & BLM.

This group hates hearing about their proximity & ties to racism, but then there's always racist crap eventually involved. Pretending there isn't is just as galling, as the racism embraced by many.

For me, that sums it up best. I don't want to hear "I'm not a racist", if you don't have an issue with the racism happily displayed & embraced by the group's core & very subject. If you don't have an issue with & want more of it, F- you!

My thinking more is like "not all Trump supporters are science deniers, but ALL of them decided that COVID-incompetence isn't a deal breaker".

 

[JayMysteri0]

It seems that it could also be that racism isn't a top issue for most of them, the same could be said for the virus or sexual assault, IMO it's baffling that anyone could ever vote this man, let alone over 70 million. But it's also hard to overlook such a massive number and what they see in him.

It seems like it's more an ideal than a person (Trump) like the tea party was back in the Obama days, they had a voice and an uprising, albeit not enough to win an election (with the exception of 2016). While we are actively engaged in partisan politics here and elsewhere, as are many Republicans, I think it's easy to overlook all of those in the middle who look at a bigger picture rather than wedge issues.

The response to that is, if racism is NOT a top issue because it isn't a top issue because it doesn't/won't have to be. Those who are okay with racism because it can benefit them IS a top issue. Racism is a major issue in this country, so much so even most racists don't like being called racist. One of the reasons we know racism is an issue is because of the major & minor effects it has, from policing to medical to housing. You don't have people in Portland who can probably count one hand the Black people they interact with daily, out there risking injury for BLM protests. For some racism is a top issue because there because by default there, and there are those who recognize that & it's an issue for them. Thus when see others who can NOT racism be an issue for them, is an admission as the picture says, 'they don't care' about fellow Americans.

It's that whole 'me' first, everyone else fifth attitude that gives us mask deniers, and whining about staying home & watching Netflix in relative safety during a friggin' pandemic. It's being 45, on a wide scale, but not wise enough to realize that 45 himself thinks me first, you suckers fifth.

When you are amongst the group who didn't vote for 45 who sees mobs of people cheering on proud boys, waving confederate flags ( at this point are they still trying to peddle it's a history thing over a specific culture thing? ), that's what stands out. All this crying & pleading that some are misunderstood who are having a hard time, overlooks that there are others who are having hard times as well, and those asshats are just adding to it. Happily.

It is NOT easy to overlook racism in an overwhelming mass. It's easy to see it as a cancerous growth that has culminated in electing the most incompetent life endangering greed obsessed idiot allowed to speak on any media. A cancerous growth that at best has been reluctantly combated NOW, after it was actively cultivated since 'the Southern Strategy'. THAT is partisan. The reaction to THAT is not.

There's a phrase, "you can't con/cheat an honest man", with the logic being that a truly honest man would not allow themselves the temptation.

I think of that phrase when the mythical 'middle' you mention is referred to.

 

[JayMysteri0]

Let me be perfectly clear for myself personally.

The reason I posted this picture...

Isn't for the joy it may bring. But because of the very disturbing reality behind it. This is a person so HURT by the idea that we can't continue another 4 years of active racial divisiveness, indifference to the safety of others in a pandemic, that they are brought to openly weeping.

WEEPING!!!

Sorry, NOT sorry! I am an immature asshole at times.

Why? Because THAT weeper maybe ANYONE. This is that random poster in PRSI, who claims they aren't racist, but when something racist does happen they need EVERY Benghazi investigation done to decide they "aren't sure and need more evidence". If you are on the shit end of the racism stick, that's a horrifying thing to see. Is that a potential "Karen"? That's someone who can & will take a blind eye, comfortable in their knowledge it can't happen to them. If efforts are made to address that issue, they will actively petition to maintain that status quo because, "F those guys". Is it unfair to assume ALL are like that? Yes. Did anyone say ALL are like that? No. What I am saying is that if even 1% of that 70 million is outright overtly racist, that's 700K racist assholes, that the rest don't seem to be having an issue with. Especially the head elected asshole. What does that 99% imagine will come of that?

That an administration that actively gets rid of various forms of anti discrimination acts is doing so that the discriminated will just have to work harder. They are helping them get more bootstraps? Making people already with a disadvantage in this country work that much harder to try and keep up without those same disadvantages is good for them? No. It's a group of people who know they have an advantage no matter how slim it is, keep that advantage & if it hurts others so be it. That discouraging people of another color from other countries to come here is somehow in the best interests?

How am I supposed to see that 1% or 99%?

 

[Alli]

It seems that it could also be that racism isn't a top issue for most of them, the same could be said for the virus or sexual assault

The $6M question is - what is a top issue for them? Does it always come down to abortion and everything else be damned?

 

[Eric]

The $6M question is - what is a top issue for them? Does it always come down to abortion and everything else be damned?

Good question, sounds like the economy and ignoring the impacts of the virus. IMO it's also because there are still a lot of Republicans who just didn't want to swap sides for Biden.

Here's what Axios has to say in their exit polls, however.

• Republicans prioritized rebuilding the economy and Democrats prioritized stopping the virus: When asked what was more important — containing the virus now even if it hurt the economy, or rebuilding the economy now at the cost of stopping the virus — 76 percent of Republicans opted for rebuilding the economy now, while 80 percent of Democrats wanted to see the pandemic curtailed first.
• Democrat voters were far less likely than Republicans to say efforts to contain the virus are going well: 94 percent of Democrats said the efforts were going “very badly” and 84 percent of Republicans said they’re going “very well.”
• Democrats reported experiencing much more financial hardship as a result of the pandemic than Republicans: 72 percent said they experienced severe financial hardship, compared to 26 percent of Republicans. (That finding squares with employment analyses before the election, showing post-coronavirus job losses have been felt more deeply in blue places than in red ones — because of both the policy approaches of governors and the existing structure of their economies.)
• Democrats were also far more likely to think mask-wearing is a matter of public health responsibility: 64 percent of Democrats said mask-wearing is a public health responsibility while 72 percent of Republicans said it’s a personal choice.

 

[SuperMatt]

Good question, sounds like the economy and ignoring the impacts of the virus. IMO it's also because there are still a lot of Republicans who just didn't want to swap sides for Biden.

Here's what Axios has to say in their exit polls, however.

So Republicans continue to be the party of “I got mine, so F- y’all.” The more things change, the more they stay the same.

 

[Eric]

So Republicans continue to be the party of “I got mine, so F- y’all.” The more things change, the more they stay the same.

Exactly, tried and true.

 

[User.45]

• Democrat voters were far less likely than Republicans to say efforts to contain the virus are going well: 94 percent of Democrats said the efforts were going “very badly” and 84 percent of Republicans said they’re going “very well.”

This is an objectively measurable issue with objectively measurable failures by the Trump admin.
Concluding that Republicans are delusional would be convenient but I think a lot of these numbers here represent simple trolling.
Just look at Pompeo's comment on the "second Trump admin". These guys enjoy and take any opportunity to anger the libs.

 

[JayMysteri0]

This is the kind of thing that a group will be judged by, for which they would condemn others for doing,
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1327841037390376961/

Their feelings matter more than the place that put those signs up on their property.

One can never underestimate the power of entitlement & privilege some feel, but hate being called on.

 

[User.168]

.

 

[JayMysteri0]

I realize that the case for 45 supporters is best made by 45 supporters
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1328324085072482306/

 

[Edd]

I realize that the case for 45 supporters is best made by 45 supporters
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1328324085072482306/

Perfectly exemplifies Obama’s quote about allowing people to show their ignorance by letting them talk.

For her, “socialism” is a scary word she hears a lot from conservative media. She requires no further information, because non-whites are are frightening, and want all her stuff.

 

[User.45]

Perfectly exemplifies Obama’s quote about allowing people to show their ignorance by letting them talk.

For her, “socialism” is a scary word she hears a lot from conservative media. She requires no further information, because non-whites are are frightening, and want all her stuff.

Didn't BANnon say one of the principle rules is never to play defense?
These guys will now be forced to play D because their attacks will be just ignored.
And if we ever want to deal with their ramblings, just give them a taste of their own medicine: Whataboutism. Difference is that we won't have to make up stuff.

 

[Huntn]

My thinking more is like "not all Trump supporters are science deniers, but ALL of them decided that COVID-incompetence isn't a deal breaker".

People are suffering with loss of loved ones, but by much bigger numbers experiencing financial distress and many of them wrongly imagine imo, that the President who blows off COVID or minimizes it and gets everything opened back up, the safer their job will be or the sooner they will get it back, and things will go back to normal, when that is just not the case.

The thing is if we don’t want our medical facilities overwhelmed, we must alter our activities, and how we conduct business and a significant chunk of people just want go back to normal, even rejecting mask wearing because of 1) mixed inconsistent messaging from the Head Incompetent going as far as mask shaming or 2) financial desperation looms larger in their lives than fear of COVID.

And after COVID is corralled I don’t even want to think about the ramifications of the continued increase in National Debt.

Under Trump's Administration, America's National Debt Has Increased by Nearly $7 Trillion​

Under Trump, America's National Debt Has Increased by Nearly $7 Trillion

Although trillions have been spent to address the economic fallout of the COVID-19 pandemic, the debt increased substantially during Trump's first three years as well.

www.newsweek.com

 

[Scepticalscribe]

My thinking more is like "not all Trump supporters are science deniers, but ALL of them decided that COVID-incompetence isn't a deal breaker".

Covid-incompetence is not a deal breaker; cruelty is not a deal-breaker; sexism is not a deal-breaker, and, in the very specific cultural (and historical) and ethnic circumstances and environment of the United States, not only is racism not a deal-breaker, but sly insinuations that racism is not just tolerated - but actively condoned by the GOP leadership - serves to give a voice and platform to those who wish to legitimise racism.

The $6M question is - what is a top issue for them? Does it always come down to abortion and everything else be damned?

Yes, because abortion is not about the foetus, (if it were, they would have socio-economic provisions in place to support mothers, not least paid maternity leave, and ensure decent health provisions and educational opportunities for children) but about controlling women and punishing women for being sexually active, and daring to dream of autonomy.

 

[User.45]

Covid-incompetence is not a deal breaker; cruelty is not a deal-breaker; sexism is not a deal-breaker, and, in the very specific cultural (and historical) and ethnic circumstances and environment of the United States, not only is racism not a deal-breaker, but sly insinuations that racism is not just tolerated - but actively condoned by the GOP leadership - serves to give a voice and platform to those who wish to legitimise racism.

COVID is a good universal measure of logic applied, because it still affects those who at least perceive a benefit from the rest of the repulsive stuff that had been going on.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

COVID is a good universal measure of logic applied, because it still affects those who at least perceive a benefit from the rest of the repulsive stuff that had been going on.

From across the Atlantic, I must say that I have been absolutely gobsmacked - for it beggars belief, not least when the public good is taken into account - at how the action of wearing a face mask in a public space - especially an enclosed public space - has become so politicised, and such a political statement, in the US, dressed up as personal (hence, private) choice versus public compulsion.