Buh-bye Tucker

[Yoused]

so long as the interview is taken seriously by the journalist

That might scan if the subject of the discussion was a journalist. Seems to me that this guy was fired by Fox News.

 

[MEJHarrison]

He can interview anyone he wants. I won't be watching it. I'd rather re-watch Geraldo Rivera open Al Capone's empty vault. Educationally speaking, they're probably on about equal footing.

 

[AG_PhamD]

I hope Biden reverses in age and starts aging backwards.

My hope is far more realistic.

Have you seen his show? He called the Ukraine invasion a “border dispute” and says the press is lying to the public by saying Putin is a bad guy. What world do you live in where you think Tucker Carlson is going to Russia to have a serious interview with Putin?

I have seen much of what he’s said in reference to Ukaine, but it can be hard to always know whether he’s being serious, hyperbolic, or intentionally be inflammatory. Like when he snidely said “I hope Russia wins the war”.

What I think the left wing media gets wrong about Tucker and a large cohort of the right is this idea that everyone secretly supports Putin. Perhaps Tucker does in fact, but that’s not the case of with the vast majority of Americans. Keep in mind most republicans lives through the Cold War. Last I checked most R’s Americans and in R’s Congress seem to outright support Ukraine while some want to reduce the aid or enact greater oversights, but not necessarily stop it.

I think asking Putin directly why he invaded Ukraine is a very important questions. I’ve followed the war and I still don’t think there is a definitive answer. Often to a western audience it involved NATO expansion, the Minsk agreement (which was not a treaty, it was basically an agreement pertaining to the Clinton admin only) and the threat of missiles on Russia’s doorstep. The problem with that narrative is that a single ballistic submarine basically wipe the western cities of Russia, Internally, the state run media and govt officials say things like Ukraine isn’t a real country and it belongs to Russia, while troops are flying Soviet flags. And Putin has been inching their borders further west over the past 2 decades.

I think Tucker knows he has to take this interview seriously considering the entire western world is watching him. If he is dumb enough to share misinfo/info out of context, he will get absolutely slammed. If he thinks he’s going to somehow convince the boomer population of America Putin is somehow the good guy here.

His main argument has been, once you sift out piles of BS, why are we spending tons of money supporting this war and their economy, the offensive Ukraine is stalled and is unlikely to take back all of their territory (which was always a long short), Ukraine isn’t a NATO member and has never had strong ties to the US (like Canada, UK, Australia), and that prolonging the war wastes money and lives. And this conflict has only lead to destabilization around the world.

What I really hate about the anti-Ukraine war activists, ie Tucker, is this idea that Ukraine has no autonomy as just does whatever the US says (which is literally a Krremliin talking point). The Ukrainians are the ones paying the price here in blood and it’s their country, so maybe they should decide when they want to fight and when to seek terms to end the war.

Very in early in the war I think there was a fair argument for Ukraine to cede some territory to end the war- especially after the primary invasion failed disastrously and Ukraine had a better bargaining position. But after Buncha, the kidnapping of children, unjustifiable attacks on civilian infrastructure, any chances of a settlement were gone.

These are things Tucker has said that will discredit his interview in my mind if repeated
- Citing Zelensky’s banning of Christian religious practices- actually 1 denomination, the Russia Orthodox Church that is an extension of the Russian govt and found to be colluding against Ukraine during a war. Their head priest is a total Putin shill.
- Ukraine is not a democracy because they’re not holding presidential elections- not uncommon in war zones. How do you hold an election when 20% the territory is under Russian occupation? Nearly 25% of the country has left the country as refugees. Tens of thousands are fighting on the front lines and are unlikely to have the opportunity to participate in voting. Many people may be dead between the election and start of the new term. Voting stations likely endanger civilians. Etc.
- Zelensky’s clamp down on opposition media- that’s what happens when a country is invaded and pro-Russian operatives have long been a problem. It’s called martial law- Lincoln executed it as well.
- The average combat soldier is 47 or whatever - yeah, because Ukraine intentionally has not mobilized those under 27 so as not to eliminate the country’s ability to procreate.

There is no comparison between Ukraine and Russia when it comes to freedoms. Keep in mind Russia’s non-state media is in exile and people can be arrested for so much as referring to the conflict as a war.

We shall see what happens. Should be interesting.

 

[GermanSuplex]

I have seen much of what he’s said in reference to Ukaine, but it can be hard to always know whether he’s being serious, hyperbolic, or intentionally be inflammatory. Like when he snidely said “I hope Russia wins the war”.

Ah, so it’s up for interpretation, read between the lines, listen to his inflections and cadence to work out what he really means. No thanks. I mean seriously, you think that’s ok? Or maybe Tucker is too smart for us libs, it takes a sophisticated mind to know what he truly means when he calls the war a border dispute and says he hopes Russia wins. Luckily, the Fox viewers are much wiser than most and will never misinterpret his special brand of “journalism in riddles”.

Seriously dude, if you’re trying to make the case for Tucker Carlson, I’m done.

 

[GermanSuplex]

What I think the left wing media gets wrong about Tucker and a large cohort of the right is this idea that everyone secretly supports Putin. Perhaps Tucker does in fact, but that’s not the case of with the vast majority of Americans. Keep in mind most republicans lives through the Cold War. Last I checked most R’s Americans and in R’s Congress seem to outright support Ukraine while some want to reduce the aid or enact greater oversights, but not necessarily stop it.

The fact most of these people tongue-kiss pictures of Reagan and lived through the Cold War is what makes the behavior confusing. It’s not a lack of understanding on my or most people’s part. It’s not like that many republicans can accurately state why they’re ok with sending money to Israel but not Ukraine when the reasons are practically the same. The overarchiving narrative is “Trump likes the guy so we can’t be too tough.”

Please, tell me the mood around Russia/Ukraine in America would be the same if Trump wasn’t Putin’s gimp.

 

[Eric]

Ah, so it’s up for interpretation, read between the lines, listen to his inflections and cadence to work out what he really means. No thanks. I mean seriously, you think that’s ok? Or maybe Tucker is too smart for us libs, it takes a sophisticated mind to know what he truly means when he calls the war a border dispute and says he hopes Russia wins. Luckily, the Fox viewers are much wiser than most and will never misinterpret his special brand of “journalism in riddles”.

Seriously dude, if you’re trying to make the case for Tucker Carlson, I’m done.

A lot of Republicans are sympathetic to Russia, it's a really bizarre twist from a party who used to view them as the enemy but speaks volumes about what they have become. Ronald Reagan is surely rolling over in his grave.

 

[Huntn]

A lot of Republicans are sympathetic to Russia, it's a really bizarre twist from a party who used to view them as the enemy but speaks volumes about what they have become. Ronald Reagan is surely rolling over in his grave.

They are not Republicans, call them MAGGOTS, assimilated by the soul sucking Head Prick.

 

[Huntn]

I have seen much of what he’s said in reference to Ukaine, but it can be hard to always know whether he’s being serious, hyperbolic, or intentionally be inflammatory. Like when he snidely said “I hope Russia wins the war”.

What I think the left wing media gets wrong about Tucker and a large cohort of the right is this idea that everyone secretly supports Putin. Perhaps Tucker does in fact, but that’s not the case of with the vast majority of Americans. Keep in mind most republicans lives through the Cold War. Last I checked most R’s Americans and in R’s Congress seem to outright support Ukraine while some want to reduce the aid or enact greater oversights, but not necessarily stop it.

I think asking Putin directly why he invaded Ukraine is a very important questions. I’ve followed the war and I still don’t think there is a definitive answer. Often to a western audience it involved NATO expansion, the Minsk agreement (which was not a treaty, it was basically an agreement pertaining to the Clinton admin only) and the threat of missiles on Russia’s doorstep. The problem with that narrative is that a single ballistic submarine basically wipe the western cities of Russia, Internally, the state run media and govt officials say things like Ukraine isn’t a real country and it belongs to Russia, while troops are flying Soviet flags. And Putin has been inching their borders further west over the past 2 decades.

I think Tucker knows he has to take this interview seriously considering the entire western world is watching him. If he is dumb enough to share misinfo/info out of context, he will get absolutely slammed. If he thinks he’s going to somehow convince the boomer population of America Putin is somehow the good guy here.

His main argument has been, once you sift out piles of BS, why are we spending tons of money supporting this war and their economy, the offensive Ukraine is stalled and is unlikely to take back all of their territory (which was always a long short), Ukraine isn’t a NATO member and has never had strong ties to the US (like Canada, UK, Australia), and that prolonging the war wastes money and lives. And this conflict has only lead to destabilization around the world.

What I really hate about the anti-Ukraine war activists, ie Tucker, is this idea that Ukraine has no autonomy as just does whatever the US says (which is literally a Krremliin talking point). The Ukrainians are the ones paying the price here in blood and it’s their country, so maybe they should decide when they want to fight and when to seek terms to end the war.

Very in early in the war I think there was a fair argument for Ukraine to cede some territory to end the war- especially after the primary invasion failed disastrously and Ukraine had a better bargaining position. But after Buncha, the kidnapping of children, unjustifiable attacks on civilian infrastructure, any chances of a settlement were gone.

These are things Tucker has said that will discredit his interview in my mind if repeated
- Citing Zelensky’s banning of Christian religious practices- actually 1 denomination, the Russia Orthodox Church that is an extension of the Russian govt and found to be colluding against Ukraine during a war. Their head priest is a total Putin shill.
- Ukraine is not a democracy because they’re not holding presidential elections- not uncommon in war zones. How do you hold an election when 20% the territory is under Russian occupation? Nearly 25% of the country has left the country as refugees. Tens of thousands are fighting on the front lines and are unlikely to have the opportunity to participate in voting. Many people may be dead between the election and start of the new term. Voting stations likely endanger civilians. Etc.
- Zelensky’s clamp down on opposition media- that’s what happens when a country is invaded and pro-Russian operatives have long been a problem. It’s called martial law- Lincoln executed it as well.
- The average combat soldier is 47 or whatever - yeah, because Ukraine intentionally has not mobilized those under 27 so as not to eliminate the country’s ability to procreate.

There is no comparison between Ukraine and Russia when it comes to freedoms. Keep in mind Russia’s non-state media is in exile and people can be arrested for so much as referring to the conflict as a war.

We shall see what happens. Should be interesting.

Instead of analyzing his motivations as if it’s a mystery , why don’t we just call him what he is, an Anti-American, Anti-Democratic, Racist, Fascist, POS Trump Coconspirator?

 

[Citysnaps]

Ronald Reagan is surely rolling over in his grave.

Ditto with George HW Bush. And with my dad, a pilot in WWII fighting fascism. He was a *true* Republican.

If he were alive today, he'd be crying seeing how his party, and most importantly His Country, has gone down the crapper with hate and disrespect, over trump's rule. It's sickening.

 

[cbum]

Trump is not the problem, he is the symptom. Of what? The catastrophic loss of a common reality, being replaced by everyone being enabled to build their own customized self-reinforcing information bubble.

Excrement such as Carlson are the primary vectors and culprits - and beneficiaries.

I still dream of Jon Stewart's EPIC takedown on the old Crossfire show. Anyone who hasn't seen it should dig up the clip.

 

[Huntn]

Ditto with George HW Bush. And with my dad, a pilot in WWII fighting fascism. He was a *true* Republican.

If he were alive today, he'd be crying seeing how his party, and most importantly His Country, has gone down the crapper with hate and disrespect, over trump's rule. It's sickening.

Today all of the prominent Republican from the 70-80s including Reagan, if they had maintained their views from that time and still around, would today have left, either bailed, or been ejected/voted out of today’s MAGGOT Party.

 

[Yoused]

Very in early in the war I think there was a fair argument for Ukraine to cede some territory to end the war- especially after the primary invasion failed disastrously and Ukraine had a better bargaining position.

No, not really. If Ukraine cedes any territory at all, Vlad will be back for more in a few years, cf Crimea.

 

[Huntn]

Trump is not the problem, he is the symptom. Of what? The catastrophic loss of a common reality, being replaced by everyone being enabled to build their own customized self-reinforcing information bubble.

Excrement such as Carlson are the primary vectors and culprits - and beneficiaries.

I still dream of Jon Stewart's EPIC takedown on the old Crossfire show. Anyone who hasn't seen it should dig up the clip.

You can look at today’s MAGA Party and 50% of Congress (the Right Wing half) and ask they are a symptom of what? Set aside mechanisms designed to give Maggots an advantage during elections (voter suppression, gerrymandering), there is a breakdown of some kind, dissatisfaction with the democratic process, whether this is based on equal rights not achieved, or too much equality (Right Wing), this attitude if I can’t get what I want, fuck it, burn it down with a bozo like Trump. The Middle Class as I knew it evaporated and all those disenfranchised people are in “burn it down” mode?

 

[Citysnaps]

Trump is not the problem, he is the symptom. Of what? The catastrophic loss of a common reality, being replaced by everyone being enabled to build their own customized self-reinforcing information bubble.

Excrement such as Carlson are the primary vectors and culprits - and beneficiaries.

I still dream of Jon Stewart's EPIC takedown on the old Crossfire show. Anyone who hasn't seen it should dig up the clip.

I view trump as the shit-disturber who provided the sunshine and rain that enabled the hate/racism/antisemitism/etc (that's been lurking just below the surface of the ground), to sprout, become strong, and ultimately legitimized in the eyes of many.

 

[AG_PhamD]

The fact most of these people tongue-kiss pictures of Reagan and lived through the Cold War is what makes the behavior confusing. It’s not a lack of understanding on my or most people’s part. It’s not like that many republicans can accurately state why they’re ok with sending money to Israel but not Ukraine when the reasons are practically the same. The overarchiving narrative is “Trump likes the guy so we can’t be too tough.”

Please, tell me the mood around Russia/Ukraine in America would be the same if Trump wasn’t Putin’s gimp.

If we’re talking about R-politicians, most of them actually do support the war in Ukraine based on their voting records. There’s are are a small minority who don’t want any foreign aid given and that the money should be improved on domestic issues. The rest of the withholding of voting on Ukraine funding has to do with playing hard ball for border control.

Now that the mainstream left has done a 180 on immigration policy after spending 3+ years promoting a very different tone, the republicans don’t want to give the democrats a win. I suspect part of the facade of denying aid is to promote the narrative Biden care more about foreign countries and immigrants than the U.S. Now that the immigration bill is dead, it actually sounds like progress been made on progressing Ukraine, Israel, and Taiwan aid.

I don’t get that’s the impression the republicans have at all. Trump despite his weirdly favorable relationship with Putin (one might call that diplomacy) was one of the hardest on Russia in terms of sanctions. He sold weapons to Ukraine, something Obama would never agree to.

An indisputable flaw here is that Tucker Carlson is NOT the same as the mainstream republicans in office. Glenn Greenwald actually just had a thing about this, discussing how much Tucker criticized then corporate right like Mitch McConnell and Lindsey Graham, John Bolton( and as of late Nickey Haley- which might be a factor in his Fox departure. Tucker has become a staunch anti-interventionist. Tucker does a NOT support funding Israel and apparently has some fight with Ben Shapiro over this. He’s basically become the male Tulsi Gabbard where no war should ever be thought. Tucker doesn’t think we should defend Taiwan either for that matter.

For the MGT’a of the world that don’t have a strategic brain cell among her two, I don’t think she see’s Ukraine as worthy defending or that it’s not our responsibility. America first blah blah blah. We have no defence treaty with Ukraine. There’s also some opinion among some leaders and experts domestically and in European who believe the war is essentially over- it’s at a stalemate- continuing the war will not provide any major advances to either side. This may indeed be the case

On the other hand, those exclusively supporting Israel believe Israel to be a valuable military partner of the US, an valuable economic and technology partner, there are major global-trade interests in the region, weakness threatens destabilizing the entire region further than it has, And they probably think a war with Hamas and the Houthis is far more winnable- which probably isn’t the case. It’s also far less money and Israel is far more self sufficient than Ukraine is. The influence of Jewish and Evangelical Americans probably goes a lot fent her than Ukrainian Americans too.

I will reiterate, Tucker does not support us supporting Israel or Taiwan or Ukraine.

To be clear, the aforementioned are not my personal geopolitical beliefs. I think there is zero question in whether or not we aid Ukraine. I’m just trying to answer answering your question

And I’m the same page as you about why Israel and not Ukraine. I’ll do you one better though- how is pulling the rug on Afghanistan liken Biden any different than pulling it on Ukraine? Biden was rightly hounded not for leaving Afghanistan, rather the disastrous logistics and comms leading to the atrocious consequences.

I’ve never had the impression there is any sort of right affinity for Putin among any normal person on the right. Usually it’s the left wing-progressives neo-Marxists who had stints at RT that seem to prefer Russia above all, even after they leave.

And I would be remiss to say the games the republicans have played with the immigration and aid are reprehensible. Such petty tactics have tremendously bad consequences for Ukraine, the immigrants caught in this humanitarian crisis, and perhaps most offensive, their own constituents and America generally.

 

[Herdfan]

And I’m the same page as you about why Israel and not Ukraine.

Just a guess, but Israel is paying for weapons. We are just giving Ukraine money and the D's want no controls or oversight as to how that money is spent.

 

[Eric]

Just a guess, but Israel is paying for weapons. We are just giving Ukraine money and the D's want no controls or oversight as to how that money is spent.

Republican speak for "we don't want it anymore so we demand see how you are spending the money". Money isn't just being blindly thrown at them, here's a breakdown of the latest package from December 27, 2023. This information is available to everyone who chooses to read it.

Today, the Department of Defense (DoD) announced additional security assistance to meet Ukraine's critical security and defense needs. This announcement is the Biden Administration's fifty-fourth tranche of equipment to be provided from DoD inventories for Ukraine since August 2021. This package includes additional air defense capabilities, artillery ammunition, anti-tank weapons, and other equipment to help Ukraine counter Russia's war of aggression.

This package utilizes assistance previously authorized for Ukraine during prior fiscal years under Presidential Drawdown Authority (PDA).

The capabilities in this much-needed package, valued at up to $250 million, include:

• Additional munitions for National Advanced Surface-to-Air Missile Systems (NASAMS);
• Stinger anti-aircraft missiles;
• Air defense system components;
• Additional ammunition for High Mobility Artillery Rocket Systems (HIMARS);
• 155mm and 105mm artillery rounds;
• Tube-Launched, Optically-Tracked, Wire-Guided (TOW) missiles;
• Javelin and AT-4 anti-armor systems;
• More than 15 million rounds of small arms ammunition;
• Demolitions munitions for obstacle clearing;
• Spare parts, medical equipment, maintenance, and other ancillary equipment.

These capabilities will support Ukraine's most pressing needs to enable its forces to defend their sovereignty and independence. U.S. leadership is essential to sustaining the coalition efforts of some 50 allies and partners currently supporting Ukraine.

 

[GermanSuplex]

The rest of the withholding of voting on Ukraine funding has to do with playing hard ball for border control.

No, it has to do with doing whatever the f*** their boss says, and the mainstream republicans being too chicken-sh*t to call out the minority in their own flank. What difference does it make if only a minority are against aid for Ukraine, when the entire GOP (and thus the entire house in most cases since they are in the majority) are controlling the levers?

They aren't playing hard ball, they're withholding aid from Ukraine because they like Trump and Trump likes Putin, and they're giving up a bill that includes tons of their own asks because Trump said to pump the brakes. And when it comes to the border deal, many in the GOP will tell you their primary reason for not voting for it is because they're trying to help Trump. Are you listening?

Now that the mainstream left has done a 180 on immigration policy after spending 3+ years promoting a very different tone, the republicans don’t want to give the democrats a win. I suspect part of the facade of denying aid is to promote the narrative Biden care more about foreign countries and immigrants than the U.S. Now that the immigration bill is dead, it actually sounds like progress been made on progressing Ukraine, Israel, and Taiwan aid.

Well, republicans are doing a 180 on immigration policy too. The reason seems to be Biden and dems did a 180, as you say. So what's more reasonable, fighting something and then compromising - regardless of reason - or demanding something for ages and then going to bed without eating dinner like a spoiled child?

I don’t get that’s the impression the republicans have at all. Trump despite his weirdly favorable relationship with Putin (one might call that diplomacy) was one of the hardest on Russia in terms of sanctions. He sold weapons to Ukraine, something Obama would never agree to.

An indisputable flaw here is that Tucker Carlson is NOT the same as the mainstream republicans in office. Glenn Greenwald actually just had a thing about this, discussing how much Tucker criticized then corporate right like Mitch McConnell and Lindsey Graham, John Bolton( and as of late Nickey Haley- which might be a factor in his Fox departure. Tucker has become a staunch anti-interventionist. Tucker does a NOT support funding Israel and apparently has some fight with Ben Shapiro over this. He’s basically become the male Tulsi Gabbard where no war should ever be thought. Tucker doesn’t think we should defend Taiwan either for that matter.

Trump IS the "corporate right". Where's Tucker's outrage at a tax-dodging, business-cheating, campaign-fund misappropriating, book cooking, scam University, charity stealing self-professed brilliant businessman who holds events at his personal golf resort and tells his wealthy visitors he's going to cut all their taxes and make them a lot of money?

I don't care if Tucker sometimes criticizes someone on his own side of the aisle. I have over 20 years of watching to know he always sucks, always will, isn't honest, probably an actual racist. You're looking for corn kernels in a turd to defend.

I’ve never had the impression there is any sort of right affinity for Putin among any normal person on the right. Usually it’s the left wing-progressives neo-Marxists who had stints at RT that seem to prefer Russia above all, even after they leave.

You just spent a good chunk of your post defending Tucker Carlson and then say you never had the impression there is any sort of affinity for Putin from any normal person on the right? What is a "normal person"? Those who don't warm up to Russia's invasion of Ukraine? Well, yeah.... by that same standard, those Neo-marxists you speak of aren't "normal people" and shouldn't be counted as being on the left. No, that would be absurd.

Is Trump a "normal republican"? No, but he's also the leading candidate who the entire party apparatus bends over backwards for. What about the "normal" people on the right who want Ukraine aid, but can't tell Trump and his minions to STFU while we get some work done? A little backbone would go a long way. I could be wrong, but it certainly hasn't been tried yet.