RIP Haitian Assassination

SuperMatt

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I heard quite a bit about this on the radio driving to work today (BBC coverage). The situation in Haiti was already a mess, with this President possibly considered to have been staying in office a year longer than he should have. They are supposed to get a new prime minister, but he isn’t sworn in yet. Most of their legislature’s terms have expired. The head of their Supreme Court died of COVID. So who is even in charge?

I just glanced at the latest news and now they‘re saying at least two American citizens are suspects. Is that true or is that a political game? The apparent leaders of Haiti are claiming it was “foreigners” and “oligarchs” who did this. So perhaps they just found a couple Americans to arrest… who knows? I have a feeling this isn’t going to resolve itself anytime soon.


 

Scepticalscribe

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I heard quite a bit about this on the radio driving to work today (BBC coverage). The situation in Haiti was already a mess, with this President possibly considered to have been staying in office a year longer than he should have. They are supposed to get a new prime minister, but he isn’t sworn in yet. Most of their legislature’s terms have expired. The head of their Supreme Court died of COVID. So who is even in charge?

I just glanced at the latest news and now they‘re saying at least two American citizens are suspects. Is that true or is that a political game? The apparent leaders of Haiti are claiming it was “foreigners” and “oligarchs” who did this. So perhaps they just found a couple Americans to arrest… who knows? I have a feeling this isn’t going to resolve itself anytime soon.


While I don't know much about this story - other than what I have read in The Guardian and on the BBC - given the geographical location, and political sensitivities, something tells me that you don't "just find a couple of Americans to arrest."

Rather, you will "find" that some Americans are already well ensconced there, possibly double-hatted, or even, on occasion, to be found wearing three hats.
 

SuperMatt

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While I don't know much about this story - other than what I have read in The Guardian and on the BBC - given the geographical location, and political sensitivities, something tells me that you don't "just find a couple of Americans to arrest."

Rather, you will "find" that some Americans are already well ensconced there, possibly double-hatted, or even, on occasion, to be found wearing three hats.
I certainly don’t doubt that Americans (as agents of the government or not) are heavily involved in the politics of Haiti. We have a long history of political interference in that region of the world. But when the “party line” is that foreigners and oligarchs are the problem, and they start arresting a lot of people at once, you have to wonder.
 

Scepticalscribe

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I certainly don’t doubt that Americans (as agents of the government or not) are heavily involved in the politics of Haiti. We have a long history of political interference in that region of the world. But when the “party line” is that foreigners and oligarchs are the problem, and they start arresting a lot of people at once, you have to wonder.

On this occasion, no, I don't really "wonder" - for, in the course of my own professional working life, in strange and troubled corners of the globe, I have met too many peculiar double and triple hatted Americans - and so, therefore, I shall suspend judgment, until I know more.
 

Chew Toy McCoy

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This whole thing is nuts. I heard they have surveillance audio of the attackers talking in Spanish and saying they are from the DEA. Um, if you are doing an assassination for the DEA you don't announce you are with the DEA. Was a 5th grader on the planning commodity for this operation?
 

Chew Toy McCoy

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Exactly. The really clever DEA agent would announce that they are a DEA agent openly to throw all suspicion elsewhere, because everybody will believe that nobody would be that stupid to openly discuss their agency on such an operation. It's sheer genius.

If the agent was appointed by the Trump administration there’s a good chance they would announce it, but they’d also add they are the best agent and pulling off a perfect flawless operation.
 

JayMysteri0

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...Annnnddd we take another turn

The arrest in Haiti of more than a dozen former Colombian soldiers in connection with Wednesday's assassination of President Jovenel Moïse initially provoked shock and shame in Colombia and calls for swift justice.

"There's no way Colombia should be making international headlines due to a group of criminals and hitmen," Colombian Vice President Marta Lucía Ramírez said Friday after the handcuffed Colombians were paraded before TV cameras in Port-au-Prince, the Haitian capital. "They must face the full weight of justice."

But some officials and analysts now say that the Colombians, who claim to have been recruited by private security firms in Haiti, are being used as scapegoats. They point out that Moïse had numerous enemies at home — ranging from political opponents to powerful criminal gangs — while no clear motive has emerged for why the Colombians would have targeted Moïse.

The Center for Analysis and Research on Human Rights, an independent Haitian organization, has questioned how the assassins could so easily gain entry to the president's bedroom and carry out their attack without killing or injuring any member of the presidential guard.
 

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...Annnnddd we take another turn

Today's Guardian - in an interesting piece - appears to suggest that the former Colombian soldiers in question may have arrived at the residence of the President around two hours after his assassination, (thus raising uncomfortabe questions re their convenient culpability) and had actually been recruited by the President (some of them seemed to have had experience in elite units in the Colombian forces, including the provision of VIP protection) to assist in his protection.

Others wondered how there were no casualties whatsoever during the assassination (apart from the late President, of course), "not even a dog."

As of now, I think that this subject raises more questions than answers.
 
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lizkat

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Smells like some folks may have made some fine money from the inside, in becoming a thoroughly nonprotective security detail when the chips went down... and also sounds like a whole lot of distractive stuff was meanwhile thrown into the mix by the planners... the "DEA calling!" schtick seems all wrong for how that actually works when those dudes are calling... similarly the fact there were no bullet holes in the late president's close detail or outer layers of security guys at his home. How does THAT happen?

The late arrival of the Colombians in Haiti compared to what was originally suggested about their involvement in the slaying also feels like a loose end: questions abound about whom they were working for, and how or why did some of them end up on grounds of the Taiwanese embassy. Had they got lost or was that a randomly chosen hideout attempt that went wrong or what?

A really big question could be whether the erstwhile outgoing PM Claude Joseph --who himself announced the late president Moise's assassination-- was in fact the mastermind of the event, or at least a figurehead for whoever managed to design this debacle.

And how relevant was the timing of the event to the fact that Moise had so recently dismissed Claude Joseph and named a new incoming PM, Ariel Henry, so soon before Moise was assassinated

Maybe plans for the coup were already in the works and had to be advanced at the last minute because of Moise's announcement of a change of Prime Minister... was that made because Moise feared a coup? If so then there were likely still rough edges of a pending coup that didn't get worked out smoothly.

It seems especially grotesque if, as apparently claimed by the Haitian-American interpreters. that no one meant to kill the late president, just haul him into the national palace... for what? A public announcement of a bloodless coup, with Claude Joseph taking command as temporary head of state to prevent the ascension of Ariel Henry as a new PM? That sure went wrong if was how the plan went. Beyond awkward and possibly not sustainable now for self-appointed interim ruler Claude Joseph (since the whole explanation and evidence so far stinks to high heaven of an inside job).

God knows where it leaves Ariel Henry. Some reporting sounds like most of Haiti is just holding its breath.
 

SuperMatt

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Smells like some folks may have made some fine money from the inside, in becoming a thoroughly nonprotective security detail when the chips went down... and also sounds like a whole lot of distractive stuff was meanwhile thrown into the mix by the planners... the "DEA calling!" schtick seems all wrong for how that actually works when those dudes are calling... similarly the fact there were no bullet holes in the late president's close detail or outer layers of security guys at his home. How does THAT happen?

The late arrival of the Colombians in Haiti compared to what was originally suggested about their involvement in the slaying also feels like a loose end: questions abound about whom they were working for, and how or why did some of them end up on grounds of the Taiwanese embassy. Had they got lost or was that a randomly chosen hideout attempt that went wrong or what?

A really big question could be whether the erstwhile outgoing PM Claude Joseph --who himself announced the late president Moise's assassination-- was in fact the mastermind of the event, or at least a figurehead for whoever managed to design this debacle.

And how relevant was the timing of the event to the fact that Moise had so recently dismissed Claude Joseph and named a new incoming PM, Ariel Henry, so soon before Moise was assassinated

Maybe plans for the coup were already in the works and had to be advanced at the last minute because of Moise's announcement of a change of Prime Minister... was that made because Moise feared a coup? If so then there were likely still rough edges of a pending coup that didn't get worked out smoothly.

It seems especially grotesque if, as apparently claimed by the Haitian-American interpreters. that no one meant to kill the late president, just haul him into the national palace... for what? A public announcement of a bloodless coup, with Claude Joseph taking command as temporary head of state to prevent the ascension of Ariel Henry as a new PM? That sure went wrong if was how the plan went. Beyond awkward and possibly not sustainable now for self-appointed interim ruler Claude Joseph (since the whole explanation and evidence so far stinks to high heaven of an inside job).

God knows where it leaves Ariel Henry. Some reporting sounds like most of Haiti is just holding its breath.
It seems like plenty of groups want power in Haiti, so there is no shortage of motive in this case. But I agree; the timing makes it seem like supporters of the soon-to-be-replaced PM (Claude Joseph) are the most likely culprits.
 

lizkat

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And the beat goes on.... some major powers' diplomats think the ball should be in Ariel Henry's court to form a new Haitian government, since the late president Moise had nominated Henry to serve as his next PM.... even as the outgoing PM Claude Joseph now tries to tighten his control over the post-assassination situation.... and as if that weren't enough, here comes Jean-Bertrand Aristide again, just in case he can revive his past followings (amongst either Haitians or powers abroad). Another round of the seemingly endless dirge with lyrics mainly running to "poor Haiti"...


 

Chew Toy McCoy

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This thing is playing out like a Quentin Tarantino movie but I highly doubt the conclusion will be as satisfying.
 
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